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Joseph Browning
01-16-2004, 05:16 PM
BOD I've a question for ya. What is the status on transponders? I've got an idea. QUICK CALL RIPLEYS! Okay, so why don't we do this. Let everyone who wants to buy a transponder NOW do so at some group purchase price. Let's say the actual cost is $350. (I have no clue if this is even close) Let those who want to front the cash for it now do so. But make it advantageuos financially. Say, subsidize the riders $50 or something. Guessing it should be 10% or so to make it seem appealing. Now of course we'll have to charge more for the people who want to rent them or pay for them later. I think the price point should be a year worth of rental to pay for the transponder. So if they cost $350, and we have ten weekends charge them $40 a weekend. The advantage is clear- the club "finances" the transponders by those willing to make the smart investment of buying it up front. That is subsidized over time by the "finance charge" of those who are not willing to pay for it up front. The real numbers are probably way off from all of this, but the idea seems like a probable solution.

Joseph Browning
01-16-2004, 05:16 PM
BOD I've a question for ya. What is the status on transponders? I've got an idea. QUICK CALL RIPLEYS! Okay, so why don't we do this. Let everyone who wants to buy a transponder NOW do so at some group purchase price. Let's say the actual cost is $350. (I have no clue if this is even close) Let those who want to front the cash for it now do so. But make it advantageuos financially. Say, subsidize the riders $50 or something. Guessing it should be 10% or so to make it seem appealing. Now of course we'll have to charge more for the people who want to rent them or pay for them later. I think the price point should be a year worth of rental to pay for the transponder. So if they cost $350, and we have ten weekends charge them $40 a weekend. The advantage is clear- the club "finances" the transponders by those willing to make the smart investment of buying it up front. That is subsidized over time by the "finance charge" of those who are not willing to pay for it up front. The real numbers are probably way off from all of this, but the idea seems like a probable solution.

JesseJohnson
01-16-2004, 05:59 PM
We have a plan, we are just working dates, bulk prices, individual prices, rentals and such.

Stay tuned.

Jess

JesseJohnson
01-16-2004, 05:59 PM
We have a plan, we are just working dates, bulk prices, individual prices, rentals and such.

Stay tuned.

Jess

KELLY DAVIS
01-17-2004, 02:25 AM
I think JOE has been reading the WERA BBS again /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

KELLY DAVIS
01-17-2004, 02:25 AM
I think JOE has been reading the WERA BBS again /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

darick
01-18-2004, 01:05 PM
KELLY DAVIS
Member # 892 posted January 17, 2004 02:25 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think JOE has been reading the WERA BBS again


Am I under the impression that if I plan on racing with this club, that soon I will be forced to either purchase a transponder or rent one at a substantially increased price over the course of the season? Are we heading in this direction?

I thought that the club success that we've all heard of by increased numbers (membership/entry fees) was subsidizing the cost of the system.

darick
01-18-2004, 01:05 PM
KELLY DAVIS
Member # 892 posted January 17, 2004 02:25 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think JOE has been reading the WERA BBS again


Am I under the impression that if I plan on racing with this club, that soon I will be forced to either purchase a transponder or rent one at a substantially increased price over the course of the season? Are we heading in this direction?

I thought that the club success that we've all heard of by increased numbers (membership/entry fees) was subsidizing the cost of the system.

cedestech
01-18-2004, 02:32 PM
$300ish is the price of a set of tires that
most people wouldn't think twice about purchasing for a race weekend.

In the big scheme of things for what it cost to
race for a year a set of tires isn't a big deal.

If you are planing to race for more then a year
buy a transponder and be done with it.

Most all clubs are going this way. It's the future, embrace it.

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

cedestech
01-18-2004, 02:32 PM
$300ish is the price of a set of tires that
most people wouldn't think twice about purchasing for a race weekend.

In the big scheme of things for what it cost to
race for a year a set of tires isn't a big deal.

If you are planing to race for more then a year
buy a transponder and be done with it.

Most all clubs are going this way. It's the future, embrace it.

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

KELLY DAVIS
01-18-2004, 03:59 PM
how about a rent to own program? I hear thats what WERA is doing.

KELLY DAVIS
01-18-2004, 03:59 PM
how about a rent to own program? I hear thats what WERA is doing.

Joseph Browning
01-18-2004, 06:23 PM
what is the WERA BBS URL?

Joseph Browning
01-18-2004, 06:23 PM
what is the WERA BBS URL?

Joseph Browning
01-18-2004, 06:26 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Emmett Dibble:


Most all clubs are going this way. It's the future, embrace it.

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>That's kinda my only concern. Is the system that we are looking at proven? And actually I plagiarized the idea from Brooks, with some minor modifications. Not Wera. :-D

Joseph Browning
01-18-2004, 06:26 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Emmett Dibble:


Most all clubs are going this way. It's the future, embrace it.

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>That's kinda my only concern. Is the system that we are looking at proven? And actually I plagiarized the idea from Brooks, with some minor modifications. Not Wera. :-D

Chuck Ergle
01-18-2004, 09:58 PM
For all intents, the system we're looking at is the same as the one we already have. It's more than proven, hardware-wise, at least (some organizations that use the AMB hardware insist on using their own software, and that's where any problems that arise have usually come from; we've been running AMB's Orbits software in the endurance series with few, if any, problems--correct, Derek?).

I think the only problem we might have, from a hardware standpoint, will be finding a common place to mount the transponder. We've always done top-o-the-tail, but it seems everybody else is going to someplace on the front forks; the main thing in sprint racing is to get a common placement with respect to the front wheel, so in the event of an extremely close finish, the transponder on the bike whose front wheel crosses the line first is also the first transponder across the line (this hasn't been too important in endurance racing); it's also important not to have anything interfering with the signal from the transponder to the scoring loop in the track.

Chuck Ergle
01-18-2004, 09:58 PM
For all intents, the system we're looking at is the same as the one we already have. It's more than proven, hardware-wise, at least (some organizations that use the AMB hardware insist on using their own software, and that's where any problems that arise have usually come from; we've been running AMB's Orbits software in the endurance series with few, if any, problems--correct, Derek?).

I think the only problem we might have, from a hardware standpoint, will be finding a common place to mount the transponder. We've always done top-o-the-tail, but it seems everybody else is going to someplace on the front forks; the main thing in sprint racing is to get a common placement with respect to the front wheel, so in the event of an extremely close finish, the transponder on the bike whose front wheel crosses the line first is also the first transponder across the line (this hasn't been too important in endurance racing); it's also important not to have anything interfering with the signal from the transponder to the scoring loop in the track.

panthercity
01-19-2004, 06:25 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Joe Browning:
what is the WERA BBS URL? </div></div> http://forums.13x.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=12

panthercity
01-19-2004, 06:25 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Joe Browning:
what is the WERA BBS URL? </div></div> http://forums.13x.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=12

Brooks Gremmels
01-19-2004, 10:14 AM
Darick,
I'm not sure where you got the idea that the club was subsidizing the cost of sprint transponders. No other club in the country, to my knowledge has done so. And all of the clubs are in the same virtual boat when it comes to promoting events on a semi-breakeven basis. Last season the CMRA has a net operating profit of less than $6,000.
This season the BOD has taken steps that will strengthen the club through a reallocation of revenues. But "strengthing" the club doesn't involve subsidizing hardware at this point in time. It involves building the capital reserve base, it involves creating a viable alternative to the subsidization of medical insurance and it involves doing everything possible to develop the strongest contingency program possible. If those priorities were already in place perhaps new transponders paid for by the club would be an option.
Brooks
PS, the endurance transponders were mostly donated to the club through private contributions. Maybe instead of claiming to be "forced" to buy a transponder, you might want to become actively involved in raising contributions toward the sprint units. Just a thought.

Brooks Gremmels
01-19-2004, 10:14 AM
Darick,
I'm not sure where you got the idea that the club was subsidizing the cost of sprint transponders. No other club in the country, to my knowledge has done so. And all of the clubs are in the same virtual boat when it comes to promoting events on a semi-breakeven basis. Last season the CMRA has a net operating profit of less than $6,000.
This season the BOD has taken steps that will strengthen the club through a reallocation of revenues. But "strengthing" the club doesn't involve subsidizing hardware at this point in time. It involves building the capital reserve base, it involves creating a viable alternative to the subsidization of medical insurance and it involves doing everything possible to develop the strongest contingency program possible. If those priorities were already in place perhaps new transponders paid for by the club would be an option.
Brooks
PS, the endurance transponders were mostly donated to the club through private contributions. Maybe instead of claiming to be "forced" to buy a transponder, you might want to become actively involved in raising contributions toward the sprint units. Just a thought.

darick
01-19-2004, 12:47 PM
Brooks,

Okay...$6000 profit isnt enough to purchase the sprint units and thats perfectly understandable. I'm going to ask my Financial Controller wife to explain the "finance speak" regarding a reserve base and whatnot. I guess I just don't get some of the things your trying to explain when it comes to dollars and sense.

What I meant in the realm of "forced" is that I would not be capable of racing in sprints without one. Not in the forcable sense you interpreted.

I would love to know how I could help the club generate revenue for this so fire away. I live in Abilene and would be more than willing to do something (not sure what) Note: I do have 4 children that are my first and foremost financial priority these days. That being said, I struggle before each event to come up with the resources needed to play. We all love to play...dont we /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

darick
01-19-2004, 12:47 PM
Brooks,

Okay...$6000 profit isnt enough to purchase the sprint units and thats perfectly understandable. I'm going to ask my Financial Controller wife to explain the "finance speak" regarding a reserve base and whatnot. I guess I just don't get some of the things your trying to explain when it comes to dollars and sense.

What I meant in the realm of "forced" is that I would not be capable of racing in sprints without one. Not in the forcable sense you interpreted.

I would love to know how I could help the club generate revenue for this so fire away. I live in Abilene and would be more than willing to do something (not sure what) Note: I do have 4 children that are my first and foremost financial priority these days. That being said, I struggle before each event to come up with the resources needed to play. We all love to play...dont we /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

KELLY DAVIS
01-19-2004, 02:04 PM
Brooks,

Surely there is a plan in the work to do a rent to own? Everybody knows how expensive this sport is, lets not leave anybody out. Im sure there are more than just a couple of people that won't be able purchase them outright. Lets hear those gears aturning, hows this program going to work?

KELLY DAVIS
01-19-2004, 02:04 PM
Brooks,

Surely there is a plan in the work to do a rent to own? Everybody knows how expensive this sport is, lets not leave anybody out. Im sure there are more than just a couple of people that won't be able purchase them outright. Lets hear those gears aturning, hows this program going to work?

Brooks Gremmels
01-19-2004, 02:54 PM
The point I was trying to make was that the organization can't afford to work without a net. No organization should, especially when one that is in the type of business we're in. We need to put reserves on the books, we need to bring in the consulting talent to develop our contingency program, we need to provide financial alternatives to the subsidization of the medical insurance program and ultimately we need to offer more purses to more classes.
The transponders have already been purchased for the endurance series. They are provided at no additional charge by virtue of the fact that they were provided at no cost to the club.
I wish the same situation existed for the sprint hardware, but it doesn't. The BOD has been exploring every option it can regarding supplying the necessary sprint units. The recent news from other groups regarding their move to electronic scoring fits in with what the BOD has been coming up with. The thought being that it makes more sense to have the riders purchase their own units as opposed to increasing entry fees and having the club own the units. The date that the CMRA will begin using transponders for sprints will not be before June 1st and the details are still being put together. There will be options for buying and for renting the units. I don't know about the rent-to-own option. I do know that other clubs that use electronic scoring with rider-owned transponders have seen an active market in the resale of transponders from retiring racers to newcomers.
Finally, the one-time cost of buying a transponder is about the same as buying a set of tires (notice I didn't say one-time cost of tires). I think that it is perfectly reasonable to whine about buying a transponder if you do the same thing everytime you buy a set of tires. If you accept buying tires as a necessary part of racing, the concept of buying a transponder should come easy.
Brooks
PS, my suggestion about raising donations for a scoring system would be the same as raising sponsorship support for a race team. Approach those individuals or companies with the resources to make a contribution. Explain the program, the need for the equipment and the opportunity for exposure in the club's newsletter, website, announcements at the track and so on, "Timing and scoring brought to you by Pash Worldwide Industries".

Brooks Gremmels
01-19-2004, 02:54 PM
The point I was trying to make was that the organization can't afford to work without a net. No organization should, especially when one that is in the type of business we're in. We need to put reserves on the books, we need to bring in the consulting talent to develop our contingency program, we need to provide financial alternatives to the subsidization of the medical insurance program and ultimately we need to offer more purses to more classes.
The transponders have already been purchased for the endurance series. They are provided at no additional charge by virtue of the fact that they were provided at no cost to the club.
I wish the same situation existed for the sprint hardware, but it doesn't. The BOD has been exploring every option it can regarding supplying the necessary sprint units. The recent news from other groups regarding their move to electronic scoring fits in with what the BOD has been coming up with. The thought being that it makes more sense to have the riders purchase their own units as opposed to increasing entry fees and having the club own the units. The date that the CMRA will begin using transponders for sprints will not be before June 1st and the details are still being put together. There will be options for buying and for renting the units. I don't know about the rent-to-own option. I do know that other clubs that use electronic scoring with rider-owned transponders have seen an active market in the resale of transponders from retiring racers to newcomers.
Finally, the one-time cost of buying a transponder is about the same as buying a set of tires (notice I didn't say one-time cost of tires). I think that it is perfectly reasonable to whine about buying a transponder if you do the same thing everytime you buy a set of tires. If you accept buying tires as a necessary part of racing, the concept of buying a transponder should come easy.
Brooks
PS, my suggestion about raising donations for a scoring system would be the same as raising sponsorship support for a race team. Approach those individuals or companies with the resources to make a contribution. Explain the program, the need for the equipment and the opportunity for exposure in the club's newsletter, website, announcements at the track and so on, "Timing and scoring brought to you by Pash Worldwide Industries".

KELLY DAVIS
01-19-2004, 03:15 PM
sounds great, my tires cost me $60 a set. Sign me up for a $60 transponder! I knew we could work this out in a fair way. Your awesome Brooks.

KELLY DAVIS
01-19-2004, 03:15 PM
sounds great, my tires cost me $60 a set. Sign me up for a $60 transponder! I knew we could work this out in a fair way. Your awesome Brooks.

Walter Walker
01-19-2004, 04:33 PM
Ok, let me put some #'s out there. Lets use $300.00 for round #'s as the price for a transponder. A sprint day with 600 entries = close to 200 riders. The club owns 64 transponders. 200 - 64 = 136 So the club needs to buy 136 transponders (thats about $41,000.00) and then set up a rent to own program to get them paid for. I bet if we ask real nice AMB will let us pay when we can! Then I have to figure out how to pass out and get back 200 transponders every Sunday. I have a hard enough time getting back 50 after an endurance race. Sounds simple to me. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif So if anyone happens to have an extra $41,000.00 just laying around give me a call and I'll tell where to send the check. Until I get that call I think we should all start saving our pennies. We have 5 months.

Walter Walker
01-19-2004, 04:33 PM
Ok, let me put some #'s out there. Lets use $300.00 for round #'s as the price for a transponder. A sprint day with 600 entries = close to 200 riders. The club owns 64 transponders. 200 - 64 = 136 So the club needs to buy 136 transponders (thats about $41,000.00) and then set up a rent to own program to get them paid for. I bet if we ask real nice AMB will let us pay when we can! Then I have to figure out how to pass out and get back 200 transponders every Sunday. I have a hard enough time getting back 50 after an endurance race. Sounds simple to me. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif So if anyone happens to have an extra $41,000.00 just laying around give me a call and I'll tell where to send the check. Until I get that call I think we should all start saving our pennies. We have 5 months.

darick
01-19-2004, 05:23 PM
PS, my suggestion about raising donations for a scoring system would be the same as raising sponsorship support for a race team. Approach those individuals or companies with the resources to make a contribution. Explain the program, the need for the equipment and the opportunity for exposure in the club's newsletter, website, announcements at the track and so on, "Timing and scoring brought to you by Pash Worldwide Industries".

Cool! I always wanted to start my own business /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

At this point, I am grateful for a 5 month warning on the purchase. I don't buy a set of tires every time I come out to race but wish I could so it will be like Walter said by putting pennies away for the transponder budget /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

darick
01-19-2004, 05:23 PM
PS, my suggestion about raising donations for a scoring system would be the same as raising sponsorship support for a race team. Approach those individuals or companies with the resources to make a contribution. Explain the program, the need for the equipment and the opportunity for exposure in the club's newsletter, website, announcements at the track and so on, "Timing and scoring brought to you by Pash Worldwide Industries".

Cool! I always wanted to start my own business /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

At this point, I am grateful for a 5 month warning on the purchase. I don't buy a set of tires every time I come out to race but wish I could so it will be like Walter said by putting pennies away for the transponder budget /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

01-19-2004, 05:40 PM
will a person be allowed to race without a transponder?

if so, then anyone whining about having to pony up $300 to purchase should probably just chill out. the way i see it is that transponders are not necessary to show up and race; which, is really the only obligation (i hate to use that word because being able to race is not a birth rite... but i digress) that the CMRA and the B.O.D. have towards a club member.

if you do not want to shell out the $300 then do not.

it seems so easy to me...

01-19-2004, 05:40 PM
will a person be allowed to race without a transponder?

if so, then anyone whining about having to pony up $300 to purchase should probably just chill out. the way i see it is that transponders are not necessary to show up and race; which, is really the only obligation (i hate to use that word because being able to race is not a birth rite... but i digress) that the CMRA and the B.O.D. have towards a club member.

if you do not want to shell out the $300 then do not.

it seems so easy to me...

Eric Kelcher
01-19-2004, 07:09 PM
and CCS was such a bad deal. :rolleyes:

Eric Kelcher
01-19-2004, 07:09 PM
and CCS was such a bad deal. :rolleyes:

Joseph Browning
01-19-2004, 07:12 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Eric Kelcher:
and CCS was such a bad deal. :rolleyes: </div></div>Shut your mouth Eric. You don't have anything positive to say or add so just keep your comments to yourself.

Joseph Browning
01-19-2004, 07:12 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Eric Kelcher:
and CCS was such a bad deal. :rolleyes: </div></div>Shut your mouth Eric. You don't have anything positive to say or add so just keep your comments to yourself.

darick
01-19-2004, 07:20 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Joe Browning:
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Eric Kelcher:
and CCS was such a bad deal. :rolleyes: </div></div>Shut your mouth Eric. You don't have anything positive to say or add so just keep your comments to yourself. </div></div>No Joe, I think if he is a member he has the right to speak. But I have the feeling that he is under the impression we will fail as an independent CMRA. I'm just hoping we prove him wrong!

darick
01-19-2004, 07:20 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Joe Browning:
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Eric Kelcher:
and CCS was such a bad deal. :rolleyes: </div></div>Shut your mouth Eric. You don't have anything positive to say or add so just keep your comments to yourself. </div></div>No Joe, I think if he is a member he has the right to speak. But I have the feeling that he is under the impression we will fail as an independent CMRA. I'm just hoping we prove him wrong!

Walter Walker
01-19-2004, 07:33 PM
When we go to electronic scoring for sprints June 1 you WILL have to have a transponder to race. As I said SAVE YOUR PENNIES we have 5 months.

Walter Walker
01-19-2004, 07:33 PM
When we go to electronic scoring for sprints June 1 you WILL have to have a transponder to race. As I said SAVE YOUR PENNIES we have 5 months.

Derek Delpero
01-19-2004, 07:39 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by john w black:
will a person be allowed to race without a transponder?

</div></div>I don't know what the BOD's or Walter's position is on this but, as far as I'm concerned, if you don't have a transponder, you should not be on the track. I know that sounds harsh, but it gets way too confusing trying to figure out if a bike has a transponder that doesn't work, or if the bike just doesn't have a transponder.

Obviously, if you are on the track with out a transponder, you won't get scored. To me it pretty much defeats the purpose of having transponders if we still have to go back and manually score races.

My 2 cents - Derek

Derek Delpero
01-19-2004, 07:39 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by john w black:
will a person be allowed to race without a transponder?

</div></div>I don't know what the BOD's or Walter's position is on this but, as far as I'm concerned, if you don't have a transponder, you should not be on the track. I know that sounds harsh, but it gets way too confusing trying to figure out if a bike has a transponder that doesn't work, or if the bike just doesn't have a transponder.

Obviously, if you are on the track with out a transponder, you won't get scored. To me it pretty much defeats the purpose of having transponders if we still have to go back and manually score races.

My 2 cents - Derek

panthercity
01-19-2004, 07:56 PM
In my first race, I was required to have a leather jacket, jeans, boots that covered my ankles and a helmet. I addition, I had to tape over my headlight, tail light and turn signals as well as remove the mirror. Not to mention having to buy an AMA membership, local AMA club membership AND an AMA competition license.

A few years later, I was "forced" to safety wire stuff on the bike.

A few years later, I was "forced" to buy leather pants and gloves.

A few years later, I was "forced" to safety wire more stuff on the bike.

A few years later, I was "forced" to remove all the glass. (This one REALLY ticked me off. Leaving a slight gap in the masking tape on my brake light let the guy(s) behind me see my brakes come on. Learned reaction was for them to start braking. I made the most of that a few times...)

A few years later, I was "forced" to safety wire even more stuff on the bike.

A few years later I was "forced" to wear a current and approved helmet.

A few years later, I was "forced" to use a standardized number plate and numbers.

A few years later I was "forced" to wear leather pants and jacket that were either one-piece or zipped together, all the way around.

A few years later I was "forced" to safety wire even more stough.

A few years later, I was "forced" to add a catch pan.

Folks, you want to stay in the game, you ante up the stakes or you fold.

NOBODY owes you diddly in this life!

Sheesh!

panthercity
01-19-2004, 07:56 PM
In my first race, I was required to have a leather jacket, jeans, boots that covered my ankles and a helmet. I addition, I had to tape over my headlight, tail light and turn signals as well as remove the mirror. Not to mention having to buy an AMA membership, local AMA club membership AND an AMA competition license.

A few years later, I was "forced" to safety wire stuff on the bike.

A few years later, I was "forced" to buy leather pants and gloves.

A few years later, I was "forced" to safety wire more stuff on the bike.

A few years later, I was "forced" to remove all the glass. (This one REALLY ticked me off. Leaving a slight gap in the masking tape on my brake light let the guy(s) behind me see my brakes come on. Learned reaction was for them to start braking. I made the most of that a few times...)

A few years later, I was "forced" to safety wire even more stuff on the bike.

A few years later I was "forced" to wear a current and approved helmet.

A few years later, I was "forced" to use a standardized number plate and numbers.

A few years later I was "forced" to wear leather pants and jacket that were either one-piece or zipped together, all the way around.

A few years later I was "forced" to safety wire even more stough.

A few years later, I was "forced" to add a catch pan.

Folks, you want to stay in the game, you ante up the stakes or you fold.

NOBODY owes you diddly in this life!

Sheesh!

darick
01-19-2004, 08:00 PM
lmao!!!! Good one Bob /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

You need to publish that one /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

darick
01-19-2004, 08:00 PM
lmao!!!! Good one Bob /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

You need to publish that one /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

Eric Kelcher
01-19-2004, 08:24 PM
Okay positive statement the CMRA BOD has done some wonderful things like full time secretary and other positives I have noted before but Electronic timing and scoring they have not. For what has been spent already a complete system could have been purchased through CCS. Now at least 50% more will have to be spent (if CMRA purchases enough to cover 200 rider field) and if each member has to purchase one individually then it is more like 600% (500 riders each owning one). WERA has gone same route and with competition(CCS) providing transponders time will tell which the riders prefer.

Will CMRA fail? no I doubt it but what I had said was GLRRA had been part of CCS and then failed after returning to independent status; can we learn from GLRRA's mistakes? They also required their riders to purchase personal transponders

Eric Kelcher
01-19-2004, 08:24 PM
Okay positive statement the CMRA BOD has done some wonderful things like full time secretary and other positives I have noted before but Electronic timing and scoring they have not. For what has been spent already a complete system could have been purchased through CCS. Now at least 50% more will have to be spent (if CMRA purchases enough to cover 200 rider field) and if each member has to purchase one individually then it is more like 600% (500 riders each owning one). WERA has gone same route and with competition(CCS) providing transponders time will tell which the riders prefer.

Will CMRA fail? no I doubt it but what I had said was GLRRA had been part of CCS and then failed after returning to independent status; can we learn from GLRRA's mistakes? They also required their riders to purchase personal transponders

Joseph Browning
01-19-2004, 08:53 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Eric Kelcher:
Okay positive statement the CMRA BOD has done some wonderful things like full time secretary and other positives I have noted before but Electronic timing and scoring they have not.</div></div>WOW! Thanks, that is EXACTLY what I am talking about. Positive discourse, even if it's expressing concern or doubt. I think THAT is awesome, and will ABSOLUTELY retract my statement that you should shut up. Thanks for proving me wrong Eric, you aren't a complete jerk! :-) As to the rest of this and the other points you have, I'd like to know if the BOD is aware of what's happened in the past and if that plays into the decision.

Joseph Browning
01-19-2004, 08:53 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Eric Kelcher:
Okay positive statement the CMRA BOD has done some wonderful things like full time secretary and other positives I have noted before but Electronic timing and scoring they have not.</div></div>WOW! Thanks, that is EXACTLY what I am talking about. Positive discourse, even if it's expressing concern or doubt. I think THAT is awesome, and will ABSOLUTELY retract my statement that you should shut up. Thanks for proving me wrong Eric, you aren't a complete jerk! :-) As to the rest of this and the other points you have, I'd like to know if the BOD is aware of what's happened in the past and if that plays into the decision.

Joseph Browning
01-19-2004, 09:03 PM
I'm with Bob on this one guys. This is an expensive sport. $300 is a good chunk of change, but change is necessary. I, for one, will help out anybody who has a genuine need for support. The benefits of this system so far outweigh the costs it seems like a no brainer.

Joseph Browning
01-19-2004, 09:03 PM
I'm with Bob on this one guys. This is an expensive sport. $300 is a good chunk of change, but change is necessary. I, for one, will help out anybody who has a genuine need for support. The benefits of this system so far outweigh the costs it seems like a no brainer.

TXFZ1
01-19-2004, 10:38 PM
Apples and Oranges

Tires are required to race if worn out they can hurt a racer and then it is a safety issue. The only benefit for sprint transponders is a smoother race day and a happier race org. Lap times are cool, but not required.

Is this the official notice? Give us as much time as to plan/save out pennies.

David

TXFZ1
01-19-2004, 10:38 PM
Apples and Oranges

Tires are required to race if worn out they can hurt a racer and then it is a safety issue. The only benefit for sprint transponders is a smoother race day and a happier race org. Lap times are cool, but not required.

Is this the official notice? Give us as much time as to plan/save out pennies.

David

cedestech
01-19-2004, 11:43 PM
Walter said it. 5 months. Sounds official to me.

I just want to know when we can start to
purchase ours.

If you don't want to make the slightly paid/volenteers staff's race day any easier just let them know at the gate, registration, tech and
before you head out to the grid. I'm sure they
would like to note your name and number.

If me buying a $300 transponder makes the people
who make my race day possible even slightly more
agreeable/happy I'm all for it.

Once the staff is completely full time, well
paid employee's we (the racers) can dictate
how we want to play the game.

Since they work for money that in most cases
doesn't cover their fuel bill to and from the
track I'm for doing anything it takes to make
their weekend easier.

BTW, good one Bob. Thats the truth isn't it.

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

cedestech
01-19-2004, 11:43 PM
Walter said it. 5 months. Sounds official to me.

I just want to know when we can start to
purchase ours.

If you don't want to make the slightly paid/volenteers staff's race day any easier just let them know at the gate, registration, tech and
before you head out to the grid. I'm sure they
would like to note your name and number.

If me buying a $300 transponder makes the people
who make my race day possible even slightly more
agreeable/happy I'm all for it.

Once the staff is completely full time, well
paid employee's we (the racers) can dictate
how we want to play the game.

Since they work for money that in most cases
doesn't cover their fuel bill to and from the
track I'm for doing anything it takes to make
their weekend easier.

BTW, good one Bob. Thats the truth isn't it.

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

Mike Wright
01-20-2004, 07:41 AM
After reading this, seems the real concern should be somebody racing on $60 takeoffs. That is foolish! Those will cause a lot more damage than the cost of a transponder. To the rider on the worn out tires and his equipment , or worse, somebody else who ponied up for good tires and their equipment.

Mike Wright
01-20-2004, 07:41 AM
After reading this, seems the real concern should be somebody racing on $60 takeoffs. That is foolish! Those will cause a lot more damage than the cost of a transponder. To the rider on the worn out tires and his equipment , or worse, somebody else who ponied up for good tires and their equipment.

Brooks Gremmels
01-20-2004, 08:49 AM
Eric, according to Kevin Elliott, your boss at CCS, GLLRA was in financial trouble and unable to even pay its sponsoring fees to CCS in 2001. If I recall our conversation correctly, CCS was going to come in and help that organization finish running its season. In other words, GLLRA failed as a CCS affiliate? I don't know for sure but I do know for sure that the CMRA is doing fine with, just as it was with WERA, CCS and an Independent. Bting it.
Regarding your comments about timing and scoring are hypocritical as well.Your wife (and CCS employee) was recently quoted in RRWorld in regards to the continuing difficulties your organizastion has with its hybred scoring system. Regarding the on-going problems they are having, she was quoted as saying they have to reboot the system during events on a regular basis. I will get my copy of the article and post the full conversation. Our AMB system is the best there is.
Brooks

Brooks Gremmels
01-20-2004, 08:49 AM
Eric, according to Kevin Elliott, your boss at CCS, GLLRA was in financial trouble and unable to even pay its sponsoring fees to CCS in 2001. If I recall our conversation correctly, CCS was going to come in and help that organization finish running its season. In other words, GLLRA failed as a CCS affiliate? I don't know for sure but I do know for sure that the CMRA is doing fine with, just as it was with WERA, CCS and an Independent. Bting it.
Regarding your comments about timing and scoring are hypocritical as well.Your wife (and CCS employee) was recently quoted in RRWorld in regards to the continuing difficulties your organizastion has with its hybred scoring system. Regarding the on-going problems they are having, she was quoted as saying they have to reboot the system during events on a regular basis. I will get my copy of the article and post the full conversation. Our AMB system is the best there is.
Brooks

SMILEYMAN
01-20-2004, 09:00 AM
Ever racer I know has selled out the $$ for a timing device of some kind (AIM, or whatever). It makes ggod sense to spend approximately the same $$ on a timer/scorer for your bike.
No reason to bring up the CMRA budget. The only thing needs discussing is placement on the bike and procedures for a failed transponder during an event...

SMILEYMAN
01-20-2004, 09:00 AM
Ever racer I know has selled out the $$ for a timing device of some kind (AIM, or whatever). It makes ggod sense to spend approximately the same $$ on a timer/scorer for your bike.
No reason to bring up the CMRA budget. The only thing needs discussing is placement on the bike and procedures for a failed transponder during an event...

Joseph Browning
01-20-2004, 11:46 AM
Yeah I just want to know when I'll be able to use the thing! If we bought the unit now would it be functional at the races? The AIM is okay but just seems to be too glitchy.

$60 takeoffs are good for tire walls, not much else. The harsh reality is that if you have to cut those kinda corners to be racing then you should probably move down a class or some other fashion of racing to keep it affordable for you.

Joseph Browning
01-20-2004, 11:46 AM
Yeah I just want to know when I'll be able to use the thing! If we bought the unit now would it be functional at the races? The AIM is okay but just seems to be too glitchy.

$60 takeoffs are good for tire walls, not much else. The harsh reality is that if you have to cut those kinda corners to be racing then you should probably move down a class or some other fashion of racing to keep it affordable for you.

mark niemi
01-20-2004, 12:23 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2451995304

I hate to get off the subject too much,but I'd have to say that the real harsh reality is that alot of guys do have to race on take-offs, and alot of guys do buy 60.00 tires.Not everyone has money to buy new tires every race.Some folks ride on used, it's simple.
Mike Sanchez raced on anything and everything when he was beginning, and he did quite well. I'm sure he could smoke most of us on a worn out tire.And do it safely.

mark niemi
01-20-2004, 12:23 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2451995304

I hate to get off the subject too much,but I'd have to say that the real harsh reality is that alot of guys do have to race on take-offs, and alot of guys do buy 60.00 tires.Not everyone has money to buy new tires every race.Some folks ride on used, it's simple.
Mike Sanchez raced on anything and everything when he was beginning, and he did quite well. I'm sure he could smoke most of us on a worn out tire.And do it safely.

Christopher Corder
01-20-2004, 12:33 PM
I am new so I have to choose my words carefully but...If a $300 transponder or a set of tires is too expensive then you are probably in the wrong sport. Racing is not about equity. It is the playground of people who have the resources to play. If you are getting a second mortgage or making the family do without to race, you need to check your priorities and make sure this is the right place for you.

Christopher Corder
01-20-2004, 12:33 PM
I am new so I have to choose my words carefully but...If a $300 transponder or a set of tires is too expensive then you are probably in the wrong sport. Racing is not about equity. It is the playground of people who have the resources to play. If you are getting a second mortgage or making the family do without to race, you need to check your priorities and make sure this is the right place for you.

darick
01-20-2004, 12:45 PM
Chris,

I believe everyone is aware of this sport not being cheap /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif I'm not ashamed to say my family comes first tho.

How about this....since not everyone in the club gets on these darn puters these days, how bout a mandotory riders meeting at the first race event and we tell all that we have approximately 3 months to budget for a transponder.

darick
01-20-2004, 12:45 PM
Chris,

I believe everyone is aware of this sport not being cheap /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif I'm not ashamed to say my family comes first tho.

How about this....since not everyone in the club gets on these darn puters these days, how bout a mandotory riders meeting at the first race event and we tell all that we have approximately 3 months to budget for a transponder.

cedestech
01-20-2004, 01:08 PM
"ALLOT" of people race outside their budget.

I tried dirt roundy round for a about a year
in the late 90's and some of those people
had no bussiness paying the gate fee much less
building and driving race cars.

"I'd like to thank my sponsors....

Visa, Mastercard, Equity First home refinancing...."

Big /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

cedestech
01-20-2004, 01:08 PM
"ALLOT" of people race outside their budget.

I tried dirt roundy round for a about a year
in the late 90's and some of those people
had no bussiness paying the gate fee much less
building and driving race cars.

"I'd like to thank my sponsors....

Visa, Mastercard, Equity First home refinancing...."

Big /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

panthercity
01-20-2004, 01:28 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Emmett Dibble:

"I'd like to thank my sponsors....

Visa, Mastercard, Equity First home refinancing...."

Big /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>I'm glad to see somebody worthy got my old sponsors...

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

panthercity
01-20-2004, 01:28 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Emmett Dibble:

"I'd like to thank my sponsors....

Visa, Mastercard, Equity First home refinancing...."

Big /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>I'm glad to see somebody worthy got my old sponsors...

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

John Orchard
01-20-2004, 03:50 PM
WERA is requiring all of their riders to buy or rent transponders for 2004.

Looks like they've got a one time group purchase available at $260 per transponder then it's $330 a pop - and $40 per weekend to rent.

Are both orgs using the same model/make of transponder? (hopefully)

Will the CMRA be able to put together a similar one time group purchase to get the cost of the transponder down to the $260 range like WERA has or would it make sense to pick one up through them before their April 1 deadline (assuming they are the same)?

http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=41096
Thanks in advance.

John Orchard
01-20-2004, 03:50 PM
WERA is requiring all of their riders to buy or rent transponders for 2004.

Looks like they've got a one time group purchase available at $260 per transponder then it's $330 a pop - and $40 per weekend to rent.

Are both orgs using the same model/make of transponder? (hopefully)

Will the CMRA be able to put together a similar one time group purchase to get the cost of the transponder down to the $260 range like WERA has or would it make sense to pick one up through them before their April 1 deadline (assuming they are the same)?

http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=41096
Thanks in advance.

JesseJohnson
01-20-2004, 04:53 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by darick pash:

How about this....since not everyone in the club gets on these darn puters these days, how bout a mandotory riders meeting at the first race event and we tell all that we have approximately 3 months to budget for a transponder. </div></div>Good suggestion!

John O, We are trying to do the exact same thing with a group purchase.

Jess

JesseJohnson
01-20-2004, 04:53 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by darick pash:

How about this....since not everyone in the club gets on these darn puters these days, how bout a mandotory riders meeting at the first race event and we tell all that we have approximately 3 months to budget for a transponder. </div></div>Good suggestion!

John O, We are trying to do the exact same thing with a group purchase.

Jess

Joseph Browning
01-20-2004, 05:34 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by mark niemi:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2451995304
</div></div>yep- there's a reason we sell them to street squids on ebay and not racers. There just comes a point when they aren't safe.

Joseph Browning
01-20-2004, 05:34 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by mark niemi:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2451995304
</div></div>yep- there's a reason we sell them to street squids on ebay and not racers. There just comes a point when they aren't safe.

Bryan Norton
01-20-2004, 05:46 PM
Can we share transpondors?

Ex: I race mini. I race only on Saturday. Could I share with someone on Sunday?

I would hate to buy a $300 transpondor for a single sprint race on Saturday that only costs $35 to enter.

I agree with transponders. This is the way to go...and since WERA is not only requiring them, but are going to the same models I think it is great. Riders will be able to cross over from organization and not have to pay extra entry fees.

The $300 hurts, and it will cause some riders to not enter the sport, but it's the way of the future...Just like belly pans, and steering dampers on big bikes.

BTW - CMRA did not raise it's event fees again this year (last year only a post entry fee was added) and in addition, not only did license fees stay the saem, but a free year of Roadracing world is included.

Oh yeah, I have already received my LICENSE in the mail. Thats AWSOME.

I think it took CCS like 5 or 6 months to get my license to me last year. Season hasn't even started and I already have mine (and it looks great, too!)

Bryan Norton
01-20-2004, 05:46 PM
Can we share transpondors?

Ex: I race mini. I race only on Saturday. Could I share with someone on Sunday?

I would hate to buy a $300 transpondor for a single sprint race on Saturday that only costs $35 to enter.

I agree with transponders. This is the way to go...and since WERA is not only requiring them, but are going to the same models I think it is great. Riders will be able to cross over from organization and not have to pay extra entry fees.

The $300 hurts, and it will cause some riders to not enter the sport, but it's the way of the future...Just like belly pans, and steering dampers on big bikes.

BTW - CMRA did not raise it's event fees again this year (last year only a post entry fee was added) and in addition, not only did license fees stay the saem, but a free year of Roadracing world is included.

Oh yeah, I have already received my LICENSE in the mail. Thats AWSOME.

I think it took CCS like 5 or 6 months to get my license to me last year. Season hasn't even started and I already have mine (and it looks great, too!)

cedestech
01-20-2004, 07:04 PM
Me too!

You bring up very valid and important
points also Bryan.

Everything stayed the same with RRW added in.

Takes a little sting out of that $300 transponder.

A $5 increase per sprint and a $20 increase in license fee with 4 races per race weekend would
have been $220!

If a subscription to RRW is worth $30 a year that
means we are getting our transponders for $50
each!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


What a bargain!

Thanks CMRA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

cedestech
01-20-2004, 07:04 PM
Me too!

You bring up very valid and important
points also Bryan.

Everything stayed the same with RRW added in.

Takes a little sting out of that $300 transponder.

A $5 increase per sprint and a $20 increase in license fee with 4 races per race weekend would
have been $220!

If a subscription to RRW is worth $30 a year that
means we are getting our transponders for $50
each!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


What a bargain!

Thanks CMRA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

R Eads
01-20-2004, 07:16 PM
I like your idea of maybe sharing a transponder.
I even like the idea of renting. the club probably has enough transponders to cover the mini sprint grids, but like Walter said, recovering them is extra work on the staff at times, plus it wouldn't really be fair to the other members who don't ride mini's to have to purchase them and the mini guys not.

I agree that having to get a $300 transponder for one $35 sprint race is a little hard to justify, but thats racing. I have to buy (2) /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif of them, one for my wife /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif and one for me.


Richard
MINI # 93

R Eads
01-20-2004, 07:16 PM
I like your idea of maybe sharing a transponder.
I even like the idea of renting. the club probably has enough transponders to cover the mini sprint grids, but like Walter said, recovering them is extra work on the staff at times, plus it wouldn't really be fair to the other members who don't ride mini's to have to purchase them and the mini guys not.

I agree that having to get a $300 transponder for one $35 sprint race is a little hard to justify, but thats racing. I have to buy (2) /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif of them, one for my wife /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif and one for me.


Richard
MINI # 93

Derek Delpero
01-20-2004, 07:38 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Joe Browning:
Yeah I just want to know when I'll be able to use the thing! If we bought the unit now would it be functional at the races? The AIM is okay but just seems to be too glitchy.
</div></div>I don't have a problem leaving the timing stuff up at Oak Hill. Not sure about the first TWS or first Cresson. Hallett is never a problem.

Just give me your name and transponder number.

More than likely it won't be split by race, I'll just leave it running in practice mode all day.

Also, if you purchase your own transponder, you are more than welcome to begin using it for endurance and RRC races.

Derek

Derek Delpero
01-20-2004, 07:38 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Joe Browning:
Yeah I just want to know when I'll be able to use the thing! If we bought the unit now would it be functional at the races? The AIM is okay but just seems to be too glitchy.
</div></div>I don't have a problem leaving the timing stuff up at Oak Hill. Not sure about the first TWS or first Cresson. Hallett is never a problem.

Just give me your name and transponder number.

More than likely it won't be split by race, I'll just leave it running in practice mode all day.

Also, if you purchase your own transponder, you are more than welcome to begin using it for endurance and RRC races.

Derek

Derek Delpero
01-20-2004, 07:46 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Bryan Norton:
Can we share transpondors?

Ex: I race mini. I race only on Saturday. Could I share with someone on Sunday?
</div></div>I don't have any problem with that.

Even on Sunday, if you raced a light weight bike and shared with a friend who raced a big bike (and you never had a combined race). The only issue is that your practice times will more than likely end up under one person.

The biggest issue with sharing a transponder on Sunday is to make sure you remember to put the transponder on your bike before you race!

BOD/Walter, are we electronically scoring mini sprints?

Derek

Derek Delpero
01-20-2004, 07:46 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Bryan Norton:
Can we share transpondors?

Ex: I race mini. I race only on Saturday. Could I share with someone on Sunday?
</div></div>I don't have any problem with that.

Even on Sunday, if you raced a light weight bike and shared with a friend who raced a big bike (and you never had a combined race). The only issue is that your practice times will more than likely end up under one person.

The biggest issue with sharing a transponder on Sunday is to make sure you remember to put the transponder on your bike before you race!

BOD/Walter, are we electronically scoring mini sprints?

Derek

TXFZ1
01-20-2004, 09:02 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Emmett Dibble:
Walter said it. 5 months. Sounds official to me. </div></div>Everybody does not get on the BBS or read every forum. Some people even pay cash for everything. I hate to have to tell some person that just drove 5 hours he can't race cause he didn't budget for a transponder. Get the message out as quickly as possible to everybody was my point.

WERA won't allow two or more racers to share transponders. Seems like it would be creating the same headacne the transponders are suppose to cure...i.e. more work/confusion for the crew.

Will endurance have to buy transponders or is this a sprint only?

David

TXFZ1
01-20-2004, 09:02 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Emmett Dibble:
Walter said it. 5 months. Sounds official to me. </div></div>Everybody does not get on the BBS or read every forum. Some people even pay cash for everything. I hate to have to tell some person that just drove 5 hours he can't race cause he didn't budget for a transponder. Get the message out as quickly as possible to everybody was my point.

WERA won't allow two or more racers to share transponders. Seems like it would be creating the same headacne the transponders are suppose to cure...i.e. more work/confusion for the crew.

Will endurance have to buy transponders or is this a sprint only?

David

Chuck Ergle
01-20-2004, 10:13 PM
Derek, I think sharing transponders might be a bad idea also--it would be your and Nancy's headache from an administrative standpoint. The only way I think it would work would be a mini rider (Saturday) sharing with a big bike rider(Sunday); big bike guys sharing them would get to be a huge headache (Bill uses his one race, then gives it to Bob for the next race; Bob crashes and Bill's transponder is out on the track someplace--or--Bill lets Bob use his, then Bill loans it to Ralph, then Bill uses it for his next race, etc., etc. Who wants to keep track of who gets scored in each race with the same transponder?). I'm for simplicity--you either buy it for the one time price and it's your particular transponder until you quit racing and sell it to someone else, or you rent it for the set rental price.

Chuck Ergle
01-20-2004, 10:13 PM
Derek, I think sharing transponders might be a bad idea also--it would be your and Nancy's headache from an administrative standpoint. The only way I think it would work would be a mini rider (Saturday) sharing with a big bike rider(Sunday); big bike guys sharing them would get to be a huge headache (Bill uses his one race, then gives it to Bob for the next race; Bob crashes and Bill's transponder is out on the track someplace--or--Bill lets Bob use his, then Bill loans it to Ralph, then Bill uses it for his next race, etc., etc. Who wants to keep track of who gets scored in each race with the same transponder?). I'm for simplicity--you either buy it for the one time price and it's your particular transponder until you quit racing and sell it to someone else, or you rent it for the set rental price.

Bryan Norton
01-20-2004, 10:23 PM
I have to agree with the hamErgler.

I think if transponder sharing is allowed, it should only be on different days. (RRC can share with big bike sprints, mini can share with big bike sprints)

Or will mini be required to purchase them too?

$300 is the total cost of some of those bikes competing...

And for those of you who say $300 is a set of tires, never raced a YSR!

For me, $300 is a trip to Vegas at a decent enough hotel. $1 shrimp cocktails at Golden Gate yummmmmmm

Uh, Im losing track of the issue now...oh yeah...

So what about minis? Require Transpondors? Sharing allowed?

Bryan Norton
01-20-2004, 10:23 PM
I have to agree with the hamErgler.

I think if transponder sharing is allowed, it should only be on different days. (RRC can share with big bike sprints, mini can share with big bike sprints)

Or will mini be required to purchase them too?

$300 is the total cost of some of those bikes competing...

And for those of you who say $300 is a set of tires, never raced a YSR!

For me, $300 is a trip to Vegas at a decent enough hotel. $1 shrimp cocktails at Golden Gate yummmmmmm

Uh, Im losing track of the issue now...oh yeah...

So what about minis? Require Transpondors? Sharing allowed?

cedestech
01-20-2004, 10:32 PM
Laura Bush is HOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What that has to do with transponders I don't know but Damn!

cedestech
01-20-2004, 10:32 PM
Laura Bush is HOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What that has to do with transponders I don't know but Damn!

waytooslow
01-20-2004, 11:47 PM
I have run a lot of off road races, rentals were usually 20 bucks/day... just a thought, granted it will take longer to pay them off, but a 20 is a lot easier to swallow. 40 can be the difference in staying in a hotel for a night or sleeping in the car/truck/trailer.

I sure hope that sharing will be allowed, some of us run different bikes in different classes. For instance one rider have a SV and a Motard (eric f. will be my example) will that person require two transponders?

Or is that on transpoder per bike number? What if someone lends a bike? (happens a lot).. etc.

I look forward to clarification by the BoD

Scott

waytooslow
01-20-2004, 11:47 PM
I have run a lot of off road races, rentals were usually 20 bucks/day... just a thought, granted it will take longer to pay them off, but a 20 is a lot easier to swallow. 40 can be the difference in staying in a hotel for a night or sleeping in the car/truck/trailer.

I sure hope that sharing will be allowed, some of us run different bikes in different classes. For instance one rider have a SV and a Motard (eric f. will be my example) will that person require two transponders?

Or is that on transpoder per bike number? What if someone lends a bike? (happens a lot).. etc.

I look forward to clarification by the BoD

Scott

cedestech
01-21-2004, 06:18 AM
Scott it's one transponder per person/entrant.

I'll be runing a 50 and 125 this year in sprint.

Take it off the 50 and put it on the 125.

What people are wanting to do is share between different racers in different classes.

If it's a Saterday mini/endurance - Sunday sprint
that probably wouldn't be a problem but
2 guys on Sunday sprints does seam to be tempting
fate.

cedestech
01-21-2004, 06:18 AM
Scott it's one transponder per person/entrant.

I'll be runing a 50 and 125 this year in sprint.

Take it off the 50 and put it on the 125.

What people are wanting to do is share between different racers in different classes.

If it's a Saterday mini/endurance - Sunday sprint
that probably wouldn't be a problem but
2 guys on Sunday sprints does seam to be tempting
fate.

darick
01-21-2004, 06:57 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Emmett Dibble:
Laura Bush is HOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What that has to do with transponders I don't know but Damn! </div></div>you nutter....lol!!!!! Are you trying to jack this thread he he he /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

darick
01-21-2004, 06:57 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Emmett Dibble:
Laura Bush is HOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What that has to do with transponders I don't know but Damn! </div></div>you nutter....lol!!!!! Are you trying to jack this thread he he he /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

panthercity
01-21-2004, 07:03 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Chuck Ergle:
(Bill uses his one race, then gives it to Bob for the next race; Bob crashes and Bill's transponder is out on the track someplace...</div></div>Why I gotta be the hypothetical crasher all the time, huh?

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

panthercity
01-21-2004, 07:03 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Chuck Ergle:
(Bill uses his one race, then gives it to Bob for the next race; Bob crashes and Bill's transponder is out on the track someplace...</div></div>Why I gotta be the hypothetical crasher all the time, huh?

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

Nancy Selleck
01-21-2004, 09:24 AM
The Board members are working on the plan. They are taking all comments and suggestions into consideration. When they have figured out the deal, everyone will be informed via the message board, rider's meetings and the Inside Line (which is mailed to every CMRA member).

Try not to panic!! /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

Nancy Selleck
01-21-2004, 09:24 AM
The Board members are working on the plan. They are taking all comments and suggestions into consideration. When they have figured out the deal, everyone will be informed via the message board, rider's meetings and the Inside Line (which is mailed to every CMRA member).

Try not to panic!! /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

cedestech
01-21-2004, 09:50 AM
I'm telling you....

The club could have raised entry fee's
$5 across the board and the license by $20
and had us paying for our RRW subscription.

People would have *****ed but no were near as
loud as plunking down $300ish in one
plop.

The club "IS" subsidising the transponders in a
way.

Maybe they "should" raise prices and give transponders for free.

It'd be the same and less people would complain.

I want to buy mine up frt.

Thank You CMRA!

(Laura Bush is wicked hot!)

cedestech
01-21-2004, 09:50 AM
I'm telling you....

The club could have raised entry fee's
$5 across the board and the license by $20
and had us paying for our RRW subscription.

People would have *****ed but no were near as
loud as plunking down $300ish in one
plop.

The club "IS" subsidising the transponders in a
way.

Maybe they "should" raise prices and give transponders for free.

It'd be the same and less people would complain.

I want to buy mine up frt.

Thank You CMRA!

(Laura Bush is wicked hot!)

mark niemi
01-21-2004, 10:06 AM
Can we rent the transponders on a "per-race" basis for sprints?
Consider this....5 bucks per sprint race. Then the guy that only sprints one or two classes does not have to spend alot of money just to rent a transponder.We could place a 5 race limit on the charges. Say, after 5 race entrys,there is no charge.It's a 25 dollar limit.
I don't have any clue if that specific figure would work;that's the number's guy's area of expertise.But twenty dollar bills seem to fly out of my hand every time we go racing,and I don't mind,cuz I love racing. I just have a finite amount of those little pieces of paper.
I definitely agree with Chuck on sharing them. It would drive Nancy and Walter more crazy.My 2 cents.

mark niemi
01-21-2004, 10:06 AM
Can we rent the transponders on a "per-race" basis for sprints?
Consider this....5 bucks per sprint race. Then the guy that only sprints one or two classes does not have to spend alot of money just to rent a transponder.We could place a 5 race limit on the charges. Say, after 5 race entrys,there is no charge.It's a 25 dollar limit.
I don't have any clue if that specific figure would work;that's the number's guy's area of expertise.But twenty dollar bills seem to fly out of my hand every time we go racing,and I don't mind,cuz I love racing. I just have a finite amount of those little pieces of paper.
I definitely agree with Chuck on sharing them. It would drive Nancy and Walter more crazy.My 2 cents.

SMILEYMAN
01-22-2004, 11:07 AM
Emmitt, If you get a chance to talk with Laura Bush, can you put in a good word for me to her daughters (both please!) Thanks!
Really The CMRA deal is the best thing going and it just keeps getting better every year. KNow any other club with 4 venues and 6 different track configs? Can you find a friendlier race environment? Better organization and leadership? We really are getting alot for our membership! Chris

SMILEYMAN
01-22-2004, 11:07 AM
Emmitt, If you get a chance to talk with Laura Bush, can you put in a good word for me to her daughters (both please!) Thanks!
Really The CMRA deal is the best thing going and it just keeps getting better every year. KNow any other club with 4 venues and 6 different track configs? Can you find a friendlier race environment? Better organization and leadership? We really are getting alot for our membership! Chris

Steve McNamara
01-22-2004, 02:33 PM
Hello every one. I have been out of town the last 2 weeks and away from my computer. We the BOD have a solid/fair plan in the works for our members regarding the sprint transponders. As previously mentioned we are working on a volume purchase price plan from AMB along with a possible rental plan. Walter brought up the issues of keeping track of rental units not to mention the ongoing logistical nightmares we currently deal with regarding the return of our endurance units. In the next couple of weeks we should have some raw numbers regarding cost's. We will surely give everyone proper notice on our plans to modernize our SPRINT scoring system. Thanks for the valuable input we have seen in this thread.

Steve McNamara
01-22-2004, 02:33 PM
Hello every one. I have been out of town the last 2 weeks and away from my computer. We the BOD have a solid/fair plan in the works for our members regarding the sprint transponders. As previously mentioned we are working on a volume purchase price plan from AMB along with a possible rental plan. Walter brought up the issues of keeping track of rental units not to mention the ongoing logistical nightmares we currently deal with regarding the return of our endurance units. In the next couple of weeks we should have some raw numbers regarding cost's. We will surely give everyone proper notice on our plans to modernize our SPRINT scoring system. Thanks for the valuable input we have seen in this thread.

Barron Houston
01-22-2004, 09:33 PM
one point was important...will the transponders work for a WERA event?? Also..put me down for buying up front. No gripes here. Joe Browning will pay for mine :p

Barron Houston
01-22-2004, 09:33 PM
one point was important...will the transponders work for a WERA event?? Also..put me down for buying up front. No gripes here. Joe Browning will pay for mine :p

Steve McNamara
01-22-2004, 09:44 PM
I believe WERA has adopted the same system. They should be compatible.....

Steve McNamara
01-22-2004, 09:44 PM
I believe WERA has adopted the same system. They should be compatible.....

John Orchard
01-23-2004, 07:20 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Steve McNamara:
I believe WERA has adopted the same system. They should be compatible..... </div></div>Very glad to hear this! Thanks for the reply Steve!

John Orchard
01-23-2004, 07:20 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Steve McNamara:
I believe WERA has adopted the same system. They should be compatible..... </div></div>Very glad to hear this! Thanks for the reply Steve!

Barron Houston
01-23-2004, 10:36 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Steve McNamara:
I believe WERA has adopted the same system. They should be compatible..... </div></div>I believe at some point in time it will be necessary to have a technical lecture on some of these matters, i.e. will it work for WERA, how do they register your transponder (so we can be sure they're doing it right), what to do if it breaks in a crash, when to replace the battery,etc.etc.

Barron Houston
01-23-2004, 10:36 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Steve McNamara:
I believe WERA has adopted the same system. They should be compatible..... </div></div>I believe at some point in time it will be necessary to have a technical lecture on some of these matters, i.e. will it work for WERA, how do they register your transponder (so we can be sure they're doing it right), what to do if it breaks in a crash, when to replace the battery,etc.etc.

Bryan Norton
01-23-2004, 11:24 AM
Please note, the WERA implementation IS slightly different.

For WERA the transponder has to be mounted on the front fork.

So I think it will work no problem (they register by transponder #) but you will need two different mounts.

Bryan Norton
01-23-2004, 11:24 AM
Please note, the WERA implementation IS slightly different.

For WERA the transponder has to be mounted on the front fork.

So I think it will work no problem (they register by transponder #) but you will need two different mounts.

Walter Walker
01-23-2004, 06:55 PM
When we get closer to the start date I'll do a long riders meeting to answer all questions and go over mounting details.

Walter Walker
01-23-2004, 06:55 PM
When we get closer to the start date I'll do a long riders meeting to answer all questions and go over mounting details.

TRCMarah
01-28-2004, 05:44 PM
Steve McNamara, Walter Walker, BOD.

Is the Volume Purchase Plan for the Direct Powered or Rechargeable Transponder?

If we purchase individually, will we have the option of using either or?

Inquiring minds want to know.

TRCMarah
01-28-2004, 05:44 PM
Steve McNamara, Walter Walker, BOD.

Is the Volume Purchase Plan for the Direct Powered or Rechargeable Transponder?

If we purchase individually, will we have the option of using either or?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Walter Walker
01-28-2004, 11:21 PM
It will be for both and yes you will.

Walter Walker
01-28-2004, 11:21 PM
It will be for both and yes you will.

KELLY DAVIS
02-12-2004, 10:28 AM
What is the latest on the transponders???? /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif

KELLY DAVIS
02-12-2004, 10:28 AM
What is the latest on the transponders???? /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif