Underwhelming Flagging

Rider goes down under braking entering Turn 7 taking others with him. Flag person very casually retrieves flag, casually walks a short distance to a position far from the track and far past where the downed riders and bikes come to rest. In other words, approaching riders saw the danger long before they saw the yellow flag, if they saw the yellow flag at all.

Is not a yellow flag supposed to warn riders of a potentially dangerous situation ahead, like BEFORE the danger becomes visually obvious to approaching racers?

How can we better prepare/train flag people? Most people respond well to visually based instruction. A summary of corner working guidelines for the new/inexperienced people working to protect us at the racetrack might be helpful.

Rider goes down under braking entering Turn 7 taking others with him. Flag person very casually retrieves flag, casually walks a short distance to a position far from the track and far past where the downed riders and bikes come to rest. In other words, approaching riders saw the danger long before they saw the yellow flag, if they saw the yellow flag at all.

Is not a yellow flag supposed to warn riders of a potentially dangerous situation ahead, like BEFORE the danger becomes visually obvious to approaching racers?

How can we better prepare/train flag people? Most people respond well to visually based instruction. A summary of corner working guidelines for the new/inexperienced people working to protect us at the racetrack might be helpful.

Radio tells stations prior to the 7 flag station to put the flag out as well. If you were somehow between the two at the time of the accident, you may have seen the carnage prior to the flags.

I have total faith in the McMahons program.

Radio tells stations prior to the 7 flag station to put the flag out as well. If you were somehow between the two at the time of the accident, you may have seen the carnage prior to the flags.

I have total faith in the McMahons program.

That is all well and good and I'm glad to hear it, but the fact remains that the flag person at turn seven was very slow, and in their chosen location wholly ineffectual. In my view that is unacceptable. Am I thinking wrong? Is not the nearest flag person supposed to make haste and take up a position well ahead of the danger? I am NOT wanting to blame or pick on the flag person - just want to point out an area that, as always, has room for improvement.

That is all well and good and I'm glad to hear it, but the fact remains that the flag person at turn seven was very slow, and in their chosen location wholly ineffectual. In my view that is unacceptable. Am I thinking wrong? Is not the nearest flag person supposed to make haste and take up a position well ahead of the danger? I am NOT wanting to blame or pick on the flag person - just want to point out an area that, as always, has room for improvement.

agreed. but our cornerworkers are hardworking underpaid people that sit in the heat for 10 hours so we can play.

I guess my point is we should be thankful for the folks who show up to do it, and have faith that Barry and Clair disperse the talents as evenly as possible across the track.

In a perfect world the flaggers would sprint to the correct spot and warn the masses, in our world they show up to a thankless job and do the best they know how.

Maybe we could hire full time professional cornerworkers? [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

I understand your concren Blake.

agreed. but our cornerworkers are hardworking underpaid people that sit in the heat for 10 hours so we can play.

I guess my point is we should be thankful for the folks who show up to do it, and have faith that Barry and Clair disperse the talents as evenly as possible across the track.

In a perfect world the flaggers would sprint to the correct spot and warn the masses, in our world they show up to a thankless job and do the best they know how.

Maybe we could hire full time professional cornerworkers? [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

I understand your concren Blake.

Blake, you find 24 people that want to come out and watch you race and sit in the heat and do a perfect job at EVERY corner. You feed them and pay them, OH you don't have to pay them, they want to watch you race, you bring them on. You figure out a way to handle the job of getting, training, and watching the corner workers and the job is yours with our compliments.

Claire

Blake, you find 24 people that want to come out and watch you race and sit in the heat and do a perfect job at EVERY corner. You feed them and pay them, OH you don't have to pay them, they want to watch you race, you bring them on. You figure out a way to handle the job of getting, training, and watching the corner workers and the job is yours with our compliments.

Claire

Quote:

Originally posted by Mark Novak:
agreed. but our cornerworkers are hardworking underpaid people that sit in the heat for 10 hours so we can play.

Mediocrity always has excuses. If all it takes to get a full compliment of competent corner workers is increased compensation, then I for one am willing to pay a little extra in the way of fees for that. An extra $2 per race entry would easily cover a doubling of the corner worker pay at OHR.

Quote:

I guess my point is we should be thankful for the folks who show up to do it

I'm thankful if they are competent.

Barry and Claire do an admirable job given their resources. Maybe they could use some additional resources?

Quote:

In a perfect world the flaggers would sprint to the correct spot and warn the masses, in our world they show up to a thankless job and do the best they know how.

In a perfect world there'd be no crashes or hazards. [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif[/img] Is it possible to improve upon "the best that they know how" and also the "thankless job" part? Actually I don't buy your "thankless" assertion. Quite a few riders wave to the corner workers during the warm down lap; I do, and I assume the other racers who do are also trying to convey their thanks and appreciation to the corner workers. As a former and future corner worker who was compansated, provided lunch and afforded an outstanding view of the day's racing, I never felt unappreciated. On the contrary, I actually felt honored that people would entrust me to look out for their safety. I felt a sense of real responsibility; and that vigilence and determination were my mission.

Quote:

Maybe we could hire full time professional cornerworkers? [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

Being a weekend only venue, and being only once or twice monthly, that might be difficult.

Quote:

I understand your concern Blake.

Thanks. I don't want to reveal my true nature and get into a brutal war of words here. :p [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif[/img] Just wanted to apprise those who are in a position to address such issues. If those same key people want some constructive suggestions concerning how to possibly improve things, I'm sure there are plenty of folks here with good ideas. [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

Quote:

Originally posted by Mark Novak:
agreed. but our cornerworkers are hardworking underpaid people that sit in the heat for 10 hours so we can play.

Mediocrity always has excuses. If all it takes to get a full compliment of competent corner workers is increased compensation, then I for one am willing to pay a little extra in the way of fees for that. An extra $2 per race entry would easily cover a doubling of the corner worker pay at OHR.

Quote:

I guess my point is we should be thankful for the folks who show up to do it

I'm thankful if they are competent.

Barry and Claire do an admirable job given their resources. Maybe they could use some additional resources?

Quote:

In a perfect world the flaggers would sprint to the correct spot and warn the masses, in our world they show up to a thankless job and do the best they know how.

In a perfect world there'd be no crashes or hazards. [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif[/img] Is it possible to improve upon "the best that they know how" and also the "thankless job" part? Actually I don't buy your "thankless" assertion. Quite a few riders wave to the corner workers during the warm down lap; I do, and I assume the other racers who do are also trying to convey their thanks and appreciation to the corner workers. As a former and future corner worker who was compansated, provided lunch and afforded an outstanding view of the day's racing, I never felt unappreciated. On the contrary, I actually felt honored that people would entrust me to look out for their safety. I felt a sense of real responsibility; and that vigilence and determination were my mission.

Quote:

Maybe we could hire full time professional cornerworkers? [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

Being a weekend only venue, and being only once or twice monthly, that might be difficult.

Quote:

I understand your concern Blake.

Thanks. I don't want to reveal my true nature and get into a brutal war of words here. :p [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif[/img] Just wanted to apprise those who are in a position to address such issues. If those same key people want some constructive suggestions concerning how to possibly improve things, I'm sure there are plenty of folks here with good ideas. [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

Blake, the only thing you seem to be forgetting is that the same face rarely shows up twice to corner work. Even you, who felt honored to be trusted with such a job ditched it for racing as soon as you could.

I don't believe compensation will yeild the competancy in every cw as you desire. $100 for a new guy doesn't get you better results than $50 for a new guy. He/She is still a new guy.

See the delimma in getting "regulars" who would be more in tune with the job task?

Perhaps you should postpone your racing endeavors until such a time as better trained personell can man the corners. [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

Blake, the only thing you seem to be forgetting is that the same face rarely shows up twice to corner work. Even you, who felt honored to be trusted with such a job ditched it for racing as soon as you could.

I don't believe compensation will yeild the competancy in every cw as you desire. $100 for a new guy doesn't get you better results than $50 for a new guy. He/She is still a new guy.

See the delimma in getting "regulars" who would be more in tune with the job task?

Perhaps you should postpone your racing endeavors until such a time as better trained personell can man the corners. [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

I have to agree- the corner working was pretty bad this weekend. Endurance and sprints. I came on 3 wrecks with people/debris in the road and saw one flag. Not good odds if someone's life and safety is on the line. I guess we just get very spoiled having such excellent corner workers that when we have anything less than perfect flagging we tend to overemphasize the negative.

I have to agree- the corner working was pretty bad this weekend. Endurance and sprints. I came on 3 wrecks with people/debris in the road and saw one flag. Not good odds if someone's life and safety is on the line. I guess we just get very spoiled having such excellent corner workers that when we have anything less than perfect flagging we tend to overemphasize the negative.

barry and claire do an outstanding job. they are at the track well before you are to get things set up for your safety. barry gives a meeting with specific flagging instructions for the day. and yes, cornerworkers are underappreciated. How many days did you work? most people do what they are required and never show up again. It is something they have to do, not necessarily what they want to do. Flags go up on the prior corner to an incident. Sometimes slower than others as it is hard to hear the radios with all the noise. I dont believe i have ever seen after a race weekend someone come over and thank the cornerworkers. on the board yes after everything is said and done, mostly by barry and claire and someone that got picked up. There are only a few cornerworkers that show up race after race. The pay barely covers food lodging and gas. so where do you want to get your experienced workers? Most people think the cornerworkers do a good job, a very good job. Maybe you'll realize this, God forbid, if you ever go down and see just how quick they are there for you and try to attend to your needs. maybe you can start cornerworking on the days you don't race and help out? Off my box now

barry and claire do an outstanding job. they are at the track well before you are to get things set up for your safety. barry gives a meeting with specific flagging instructions for the day. and yes, cornerworkers are underappreciated. How many days did you work? most people do what they are required and never show up again. It is something they have to do, not necessarily what they want to do. Flags go up on the prior corner to an incident. Sometimes slower than others as it is hard to hear the radios with all the noise. I dont believe i have ever seen after a race weekend someone come over and thank the cornerworkers. on the board yes after everything is said and done, mostly by barry and claire and someone that got picked up. There are only a few cornerworkers that show up race after race. The pay barely covers food lodging and gas. so where do you want to get your experienced workers? Most people think the cornerworkers do a good job, a very good job. Maybe you'll realize this, God forbid, if you ever go down and see just how quick they are there for you and try to attend to your needs. maybe you can start cornerworking on the days you don't race and help out? Off my box now

You go, Mark! Couldn't have said it better myself.
Anytime Blake wants the job, it is his. We will deliver ALL the shirts, boxes etc. and he can wash all the CW shirts (50-100) after each weekend. Replinish the survival kits, keep tack of who worked for their license and who got paid and listen to the excuses of those who said they would be there to work and just didn't bother to show. Then figure out if Joe Blows girl friend or pregnant wife can handle it out on the corner while he sits in pits. Oh and yes, you have to buy all of the drinks, deserts and treats to keep the corner workers happy in the heat for at least 10 hours. On race days, you can figure a way to get water to the farthest corner, having to cross the track during endurance races, because somone ran out of water. And of course, you have to wear a helmet in the 100 degree heat.
Blake, I can take criticism but I expect solutions from those who choose to sit on the sidelines and find fault.
You want professional Corner Workers? They are located on the east and west coasts. $2 per entry fee will not fly them in, house and feed them and pay their salary. We have tried using organizations, they last maybe 3 races.
We have been doing this for 10 years and tried it all. We are ready for new blood. You find it for us and we will be gone in a flash.

Claire

You go, Mark! Couldn't have said it better myself.
Anytime Blake wants the job, it is his. We will deliver ALL the shirts, boxes etc. and he can wash all the CW shirts (50-100) after each weekend. Replinish the survival kits, keep tack of who worked for their license and who got paid and listen to the excuses of those who said they would be there to work and just didn't bother to show. Then figure out if Joe Blows girl friend or pregnant wife can handle it out on the corner while he sits in pits. Oh and yes, you have to buy all of the drinks, deserts and treats to keep the corner workers happy in the heat for at least 10 hours. On race days, you can figure a way to get water to the farthest corner, having to cross the track during endurance races, because somone ran out of water. And of course, you have to wear a helmet in the 100 degree heat.
Blake, I can take criticism but I expect solutions from those who choose to sit on the sidelines and find fault.
You want professional Corner Workers? They are located on the east and west coasts. $2 per entry fee will not fly them in, house and feed them and pay their salary. We have tried using organizations, they last maybe 3 races.
We have been doing this for 10 years and tried it all. We are ready for new blood. You find it for us and we will be gone in a flash.

Claire

sorry here i go again. did anyone get a good count on the accidents this weekend? there were too many to count in 7 and these guys seemed to never stop. they were there in the nick of time trying to clear it up so y'all could keep racing. any ideas on how to fix the flagging in 7 or wherever the problem was? suggestions please

sorry here i go again. did anyone get a good count on the accidents this weekend? there were too many to count in 7 and these guys seemed to never stop. they were there in the nick of time trying to clear it up so y'all could keep racing. any ideas on how to fix the flagging in 7 or wherever the problem was? suggestions please

To the best of my knowlege we have only one or two cornerworkers that work at every event and seldom do we have the same crew on Sunday that we had on Saturday. Over the past 20+ years the CMRA has tried many different programs to get full time cornerworkers, but todate none have been sucessfull. There have been times in the past that practice has been delayed for lack of cornerworkers. People just won't commit to do this fulltime no mater what we pay them. Why do you think cornerworking is a requirement of our riders school? Barry and Claire McMahan are doing an unbeliveable job of cordinating and training our cornerworkers. In my opinion our volenteer cornerworkers do a fine job and I would be willing to bet that anyone that crashed this weekend would agree.

To the best of my knowlege we have only one or two cornerworkers that work at every event and seldom do we have the same crew on Sunday that we had on Saturday. Over the past 20+ years the CMRA has tried many different programs to get full time cornerworkers, but todate none have been sucessfull. There have been times in the past that practice has been delayed for lack of cornerworkers. People just won't commit to do this fulltime no mater what we pay them. Why do you think cornerworking is a requirement of our riders school? Barry and Claire McMahan are doing an unbeliveable job of cordinating and training our cornerworkers. In my opinion our volenteer cornerworkers do a fine job and I would be willing to bet that anyone that crashed this weekend would agree.

All I have to say on this is " Watch the last GP race".
CMRA CW's usually learn what needs to be done that morning and they still do a better job than what the "professional" GP CW's did with Katoh at the last GP.
Barry and Claire McMahon and very few people like them are the lifeblood of the CMRA. There would be ZERO racing without them.
IMHO!!!

All I have to say on this is " Watch the last GP race".
CMRA CW's usually learn what needs to be done that morning and they still do a better job than what the "professional" GP CW's did with Katoh at the last GP.
Barry and Claire McMahon and very few people like them are the lifeblood of the CMRA. There would be ZERO racing without them.
IMHO!!!

Senior Hertell said:

< IMHO!!!>>

Do not critacize the corner workers.

If you can scare up your own to come out to
every race and become "professional" much
less profeciant please bring them out.

They do a quite admirable job for the 15-20 minutes of "training" they get VERY early in the morning before they get droped off out in the
middle of the track to sit and bake.

Barry and Clare are one of the first people to
the track Friday and last to leave Sunday.

Last time I checked no one was getting rich
being a CMRA crew member. Most if not all of
them do it for the love of the people and the
sport.

If you have something constructive to offer then
offer it in public or private.

Do Not criticize people or operations unless
you have a workable alternitive AND are willing to impliment them.

Apologize or offer a constructive sugestion Blake.

Senior Hertell said:

< IMHO!!!>>

Do not critacize the corner workers.

If you can scare up your own to come out to
every race and become "professional" much
less profeciant please bring them out.

They do a quite admirable job for the 15-20 minutes of "training" they get VERY early in the morning before they get droped off out in the
middle of the track to sit and bake.

Barry and Clare are one of the first people to
the track Friday and last to leave Sunday.

Last time I checked no one was getting rich
being a CMRA crew member. Most if not all of
them do it for the love of the people and the
sport.

If you have something constructive to offer then
offer it in public or private.

Do Not criticize people or operations unless
you have a workable alternitive AND are willing to impliment them.

Apologize or offer a constructive sugestion Blake.

Blake,I would not go slamming the corner workers you may need them one day. As stated they are all volunteers and without them, there would NOT be any races.
I did not find any fault this weekend with those who spent the 10-12 hrs out there so we could race. I personaly think they went above the call of duty, like most always do. They helped my teammate and many others in a very professional manner IMHO. My hat is off to all of them.

I have worked corners, more than what is required, I even provide my own water, as to help take the burden off of Mr.Barry and Mrs. Claire. I was there at 5:30 or so, helping Mr. Barry get the radios ready, while most were still asleep. I agree with Mrs. Claire in if you have a better solution, take over the corner working duties, I sure she would glady give them to you.

Mr. Barry and Mrs. Claire's dedication is well beyond the call of duty, who else do you know that would come to the races, knowing that their home would most likely be flooded when they got home. I suggest that if your at the races, stop by and help them out as much as possible. Maybe even bring them some water.

Richard Eads #93

Blake,I would not go slamming the corner workers you may need them one day. As stated they are all volunteers and without them, there would NOT be any races.
I did not find any fault this weekend with those who spent the 10-12 hrs out there so we could race. I personaly think they went above the call of duty, like most always do. They helped my teammate and many others in a very professional manner IMHO. My hat is off to all of them.

I have worked corners, more than what is required, I even provide my own water, as to help take the burden off of Mr.Barry and Mrs. Claire. I was there at 5:30 or so, helping Mr. Barry get the radios ready, while most were still asleep. I agree with Mrs. Claire in if you have a better solution, take over the corner working duties, I sure she would glady give them to you.

Mr. Barry and Mrs. Claire's dedication is well beyond the call of duty, who else do you know that would come to the races, knowing that their home would most likely be flooded when they got home. I suggest that if your at the races, stop by and help them out as much as possible. Maybe even bring them some water.

Richard Eads #93

Quote:

Originally posted by Barry & Claire McMahan:

We have been doing this for 10 years and tried it all. We are ready for new blood. You find it for us and we will be gone in a flash.

Claire

I would respectfully request that nobody supply the McMahan's with fresh blood. [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

Quote:

Originally posted by Barry & Claire McMahan:

We have been doing this for 10 years and tried it all. We are ready for new blood. You find it for us and we will be gone in a flash.

Claire

I would respectfully request that nobody supply the McMahan's with fresh blood. [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

Working corners is difficult and thankless in CMRA and all other forms of motorsports. The CART Houston GP used mostly volunteer SCCA corner workers who had little more training than a second weekend yellow shirt. We have a few workers that serve every race who undoubtedly would have handled Daijiro Kato's accident much better than the "pros" in Japan. I am glad we have them and every other worker, regardless of their motivation.

As for coordinating safety -- Claire spent the first race weekend at TWS last year in the hospital in College Station. Barry worked his *** of by day and spent the night with Claire. I believe we were at Hallett when the McMahon's home was flooded -- they were with us in Oklahoma until we packed our trailers, then they went home and started to rebuild their home. They are there working for YOU from Friday until late Sunday (sometimes Monday), every race weekend. Whether you know them or not, these people love our sport and every one of you! Tell them "thank you" and/or offer to help!

MH

Working corners is difficult and thankless in CMRA and all other forms of motorsports. The CART Houston GP used mostly volunteer SCCA corner workers who had little more training than a second weekend yellow shirt. We have a few workers that serve every race who undoubtedly would have handled Daijiro Kato's accident much better than the "pros" in Japan. I am glad we have them and every other worker, regardless of their motivation.

As for coordinating safety -- Claire spent the first race weekend at TWS last year in the hospital in College Station. Barry worked his *** of by day and spent the night with Claire. I believe we were at Hallett when the McMahon's home was flooded -- they were with us in Oklahoma until we packed our trailers, then they went home and started to rebuild their home. They are there working for YOU from Friday until late Sunday (sometimes Monday), every race weekend. Whether you know them or not, these people love our sport and every one of you! Tell them "thank you" and/or offer to help!

MH

And don't forget Claire's amazing cookies she made for every one of us working Sunday (and Saturday, I'm sure)! [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

Tim and I worked turn four on Sunday. Spent a bunch of cash on hotel, gas and supplies and didn't even get to ride. Two guys on the corner with me were professional EMT/firefighters, so you got a whole more bang for the buck.. wrong choice of words, we were there for free. Yes, we went there for the provnov requirement. But after the first highside in the morning practice when the rider pretty much knocked himself out, we all knew why we were there and just how important this was. We did the best we could, and I know this went for everyone working corners. When more than one bike goes down, even three people is not always enough - getting the rider out of the harms way and tending to him, getting the bike/debris from the track, transmitting to control, and flagging are all important, have to be done at once and can be difficult to prioritize. Don't know if we could have done any better even if we tried.. or even did it every race weekend.

Would I do it again if I didn't have to? Half a day definitely; after about 7-8 hours it gets pretty tough, so don't know about a whole day. It's not about the money either, but the riders waiving at the cool down lap made much of it worthwile.. that and knowing that maybe we could keep you guys safe, and someone else would do it for us when it's our turn to run.

Passing the soap box.

And don't forget Claire's amazing cookies she made for every one of us working Sunday (and Saturday, I'm sure)! [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

Tim and I worked turn four on Sunday. Spent a bunch of cash on hotel, gas and supplies and didn't even get to ride. Two guys on the corner with me were professional EMT/firefighters, so you got a whole more bang for the buck.. wrong choice of words, we were there for free. Yes, we went there for the provnov requirement. But after the first highside in the morning practice when the rider pretty much knocked himself out, we all knew why we were there and just how important this was. We did the best we could, and I know this went for everyone working corners. When more than one bike goes down, even three people is not always enough - getting the rider out of the harms way and tending to him, getting the bike/debris from the track, transmitting to control, and flagging are all important, have to be done at once and can be difficult to prioritize. Don't know if we could have done any better even if we tried.. or even did it every race weekend.

Would I do it again if I didn't have to? Half a day definitely; after about 7-8 hours it gets pretty tough, so don't know about a whole day. It's not about the money either, but the riders waiving at the cool down lap made much of it worthwile.. that and knowing that maybe we could keep you guys safe, and someone else would do it for us when it's our turn to run.

Passing the soap box.

From my perspective, the corner workers were working doubletime on Sunday.
Thank you turn 6 corner workers, whoever you were. [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

I havent been to many races, but from what I could gather is there were alot of crashes. Why?
My opinion is that the track out there at OHR sux! And I also think thats part of the reason there were so many crashes....mine included. Same scenario at a different track and i would not have crashed. Lowside coming out of turn 6 going up the hill, back end came around without notice. But thats part of racing i guess.

Maybe there was/is a need for more corner workers at ohr specifically. When i was down, a rider going into turn 6 went off. kinda leaves nobody holding down the fort.
However, i'm not about to complain about the corner workers or those who are responsible for them. But i dont think Blake making a suggestion on how to better prepare cornerworkers was all that out of line.

From my perspective, the corner workers were working doubletime on Sunday.
Thank you turn 6 corner workers, whoever you were. [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

I havent been to many races, but from what I could gather is there were alot of crashes. Why?
My opinion is that the track out there at OHR sux! And I also think thats part of the reason there were so many crashes....mine included. Same scenario at a different track and i would not have crashed. Lowside coming out of turn 6 going up the hill, back end came around without notice. But thats part of racing i guess.

Maybe there was/is a need for more corner workers at ohr specifically. When i was down, a rider going into turn 6 went off. kinda leaves nobody holding down the fort.
However, i'm not about to complain about the corner workers or those who are responsible for them. But i dont think Blake making a suggestion on how to better prepare cornerworkers was all that out of line.

Quote:

Originally posted by Rick Chapman:

However, i'm not about to complain about the corner workers or those who are responsible for them. But i dont think Blake making a suggestion on how to better prepare cornerworkers was all that out of line.

the reason people are taking exception is that blake did not make a suggestion. he just came on here *****in' and moanin' without all the facts as to what happened on the incident that he was reffering to.

not surprising really, he also thought the beull would become the dominant lghtwt twin bike too!!!! [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

Quote:

Originally posted by Rick Chapman:

However, i'm not about to complain about the corner workers or those who are responsible for them. But i dont think Blake making a suggestion on how to better prepare cornerworkers was all that out of line.

the reason people are taking exception is that blake did not make a suggestion. he just came on here *****in' and moanin' without all the facts as to what happened on the incident that he was reffering to.

not surprising really, he also thought the beull would become the dominant lghtwt twin bike too!!!! [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

Thats exactly what it boils down to.

This is as much Blakes club as it is mine
or anyone elses.

BUT.....

Unless you have something constructive to offer
don't critasize without knowing all the facts.

Barry and the rest of the crew would be more then happy to listen to any sugestions that
could help aliviate the situation with corner
workers. If some one could find a permanant
and workable solution they'd probably be elected
king.

Complaining has never helped anything.

Thats exactly what it boils down to.

This is as much Blakes club as it is mine
or anyone elses.

BUT.....

Unless you have something constructive to offer
don't critasize without knowing all the facts.

Barry and the rest of the crew would be more then happy to listen to any sugestions that
could help aliviate the situation with corner
workers. If some one could find a permanant
and workable solution they'd probably be elected
king.

Complaining has never helped anything.

I have been doing this for a few years now, and think the corner workers do a pretty good job considering the mass majority are volunteers. Barry and Claire are huge part of the infrastructure of this club. These two people give up allot of time every year so we can have fun and be as safe as possible. They also perform numerous other duty's behind the scenes. You should be praising them not critizing them!

So Blake next time you want to criticize make sure you have some form of suggestion to go along with it. This club is a business, but it is also a big family that takes care of one another, and I couldn't think of any body else that I would want looking out for my safety than Barry and Claire.

Tim Haas
CMRA #4

I have been doing this for a few years now, and think the corner workers do a pretty good job considering the mass majority are volunteers. Barry and Claire are huge part of the infrastructure of this club. These two people give up allot of time every year so we can have fun and be as safe as possible. They also perform numerous other duty's behind the scenes. You should be praising them not critizing them!

So Blake next time you want to criticize make sure you have some form of suggestion to go along with it. This club is a business, but it is also a big family that takes care of one another, and I couldn't think of any body else that I would want looking out for my safety than Barry and Claire.

Tim Haas
CMRA #4

Having raced, cornerworked, and moer with the CMRA for over 7 years, I have one simple question.

This is for everyone, not just Blake.

When was the last time you gave a thumbs up to the corner workers on your cool down lap?

When was the last time you walked up to them at the end of the day and shook their hands and said "thanks"?

Not here, not in a general 'thanks to the cornerworker' statement, but a genuine, in person thank you???

While we do get about half of our corner workers from the Prov-am requirements, the other half are out there just to help out.

They have to be at the track at 6:30 am, and on Saturday get a 'lunch' at 10am for about 20 minutes. Other than that they work 12 hours straight, for $40 (or free if they are doing it for amatuer status)

They end the day famished and sunburnt.

There are very few (Cindy Bolt is one) who want to run the entire circuit for this kind of work.

What I ask, is that the racers show their appreciation from time to time. Wave on the cool off lap, come up to them after the race and offer them a drink or just say thanks in person.
(How about saying thanks in advance at the beginning of the day?

I bet it would go a long way to improving our cornerworker attitude.

It is the hardest, most underappreciated task in roadracing.

Having raced, cornerworked, and moer with the CMRA for over 7 years, I have one simple question.

This is for everyone, not just Blake.

When was the last time you gave a thumbs up to the corner workers on your cool down lap?

When was the last time you walked up to them at the end of the day and shook their hands and said "thanks"?

Not here, not in a general 'thanks to the cornerworker' statement, but a genuine, in person thank you???

While we do get about half of our corner workers from the Prov-am requirements, the other half are out there just to help out.

They have to be at the track at 6:30 am, and on Saturday get a 'lunch' at 10am for about 20 minutes. Other than that they work 12 hours straight, for $40 (or free if they are doing it for amatuer status)

They end the day famished and sunburnt.

There are very few (Cindy Bolt is one) who want to run the entire circuit for this kind of work.

What I ask, is that the racers show their appreciation from time to time. Wave on the cool off lap, come up to them after the race and offer them a drink or just say thanks in person.
(How about saying thanks in advance at the beginning of the day?

I bet it would go a long way to improving our cornerworker attitude.

It is the hardest, most underappreciated task in roadracing.

Bryan,
Excellent points. I try to wave on the cool-down lap, but sometimes get halfway through before my brain releases from "race mode" and I remember.

Just a tiny little thought: if the corner workers could make it, why not have a moment either at the rider's meeting or at the awards presentation where they are noted, pointed out, introduced as a group, and all the riders could at the very minimum, give them a nice round of applause. These folks are facilitating our habit and we ought to try and at least give them a warm fuzzy.

Would also help enable us to find the right people to thank at the end of the day (other than catching them while they're still in the cornerworker's shirt).

Just a thought,

Bryan,
Excellent points. I try to wave on the cool-down lap, but sometimes get halfway through before my brain releases from "race mode" and I remember.

Just a tiny little thought: if the corner workers could make it, why not have a moment either at the rider's meeting or at the awards presentation where they are noted, pointed out, introduced as a group, and all the riders could at the very minimum, give them a nice round of applause. These folks are facilitating our habit and we ought to try and at least give them a warm fuzzy.

Would also help enable us to find the right people to thank at the end of the day (other than catching them while they're still in the cornerworker's shirt).

Just a thought,

last year they had a drawing every weekend for a gift certificate to macaroni grill or something like that that was donated. that was pretty cool for the cornerworkers. Some even brought donuts or kolaches early in the morning for them before they went out. Its the little things that make it worthwhile.

last year they had a drawing every weekend for a gift certificate to macaroni grill or something like that that was donated. that was pretty cool for the cornerworkers. Some even brought donuts or kolaches early in the morning for them before they went out. Its the little things that make it worthwhile.