Lap time minimums?

This is a two part question.


Does the CMRA have lap time requirements for racers? When does a new racer become slow enough to be a safety hazard? Is running a 3:06 at TWS not a problem? What actually goes into

certain track day orgs requirements the same and strict enough to ensure that the rider has the skill, awareness, and ability to not be a safety hazard?

if the above is not standardized, then when does the CMRA officials authorize and implement the blue flag for use?

This is is up for discussion here for everyone, but if any official wants to discuss my incident, referencing above as an idea of what I am coming from, feel free to contact me. And before the comments come out about its racing and that's what happens, I understand this and fully except rewards and consequences of racing. This is a question about safety of all racers and the riders that are too slow and inexperienced for a safe experience.

details....what was your incident?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qtPy3Q16Do

Mitchell I understand what you are saying, but that is why prov novs wear big yellow shirts. it is all our responsibilities to recognize that the people wearing those shirts are not as experienced as others. And we need to make sure to pass them with caution. I think you got caught up chasing John redford out of the chicayne, and didn't pay enough attention to the slower rider. my .02
sorry you went down, hope you and the bike are ok.

One part of your answer is that we (LSTD) do monitor new racers getting their license with us for safety. Is there a lap time policy? No. But safety is a good catchall for allowing a rider to get their license application or not.

I'm sure the other licensing entities monitor things in the same manner.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jose gutierrez

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qtPy3Q16Do

Mitchell I understand what you are saying, but that is why prov novs wear big yellow shirts. it is all our responsibilities to recognize that the people wearing those shirts are not as experienced as others. And we need to make sure to pass them with caution. I think you got caught up chasing John redford out of the chicayne, and didn't pay enough attention to the slower rider. my .02
sorry you went down, hope you and the bike are ok.

---

truth be told, I did get caught up trying to chase him down. Everyone is guilty of that. If you look at the video though, I think two things happened. I tried to pass him on the outside, and I believe john scared him with the pass so he stands the bike up and travels offline enough for me to collide with him. Ultimately it's my fault I hit him, but inexperienced does play a role in it. I believe. This was his second day at this track in a row and he didn't seem to know the lines, a little unpredictable. Believe me I am not looking for validation or repayment. Just wanted to see if a guy can come off the street if his bike is legal and he has the gear? Just curious.

I know now with other organizations who have to run in the fastest class or 2nd to fastest class on small bikes. But a 3:06 would not be a time ran in either of those. Inside passing is a comfort thing and no experience with these passes can startle people.

i didn't see that yellow shirt do anything wrong or even unpredictable...

I'm not sure he really had anywhere to go. The prov nov's line looked off even before John passed him and then just carried him into the path of the other 250 that was on the correct line. of course if he was already off the line sometimes you have to slow down and just see where they're going. But he didn't really seem to react TOO much to the pass but already had a bad line and had to stand up to miss the curbing on the right. But depth is hard to tell from a wide-angle gopro shot. Of course the passer is responsible for the pass but if somebody jumps out in front of you...

As I've participated in Fastline mock races with all kinds of candidates I've see quite a few that afterwards I think, "Yes you met the requirements and didn't crash in the mock race, but I'm not sure you're ready for an actual race". It's my opinion that you need to be riding in the Advanced sessions first and kind of cringe when a slow intermediate rider is in a mock race. Of course on a 250-class bike, Advanced really isn't an option as the closing speeds can be so great but then that's another reason we run lightweight at GSS and sometimes at MSRH. I know we'll bump somebody down if they're just out of their league or unsafe at a track day, but as I don't teach the CMRA class, I don't think there's any minimum requirements for rider performance other than "don't crash".

Again guys this isn't about my crash, it's about if a time is too slow or are they skilled enough to be racing

Unfortunately there's not a time minimum in racing. There are no levels like there are on trackdays so all you got is maybe a yellow shirt or you being the more skilled and faster rider need to make a pass. Usually the nooby has the brains to know if they are ready to be elbow to elbow in a race. Not sure if the CMRA would like to police laptimes minimums especially on a layout that was changed last minute. This was an unfortunate situation in a turn that's difficult to pass. Hope you and the other rider and bikes are ok.

Back before Trackdays no one got to practice before race practice and just gridding up. So it is safe to say that YES a 3:06 would be expected. It is your job to make the pass, period. Just wait until the next turn. I realize that on a 250 that could mean losing the race but hey, that's racing.

Just wait till it rains and someone is out there on slicks and you are on rains..

^^^ back when some of us started racing, there were no track days to get your feet wet... it was trial by fire... you wanted to race, you went and raced... I still do not think that was a bad thing...

Add to the ProvNov mental baggage that everyone around him (including that voice in his head) is telling him to "just get through the race without crashing'" which causes some people to overcompensate and just putt around giving everyone room to pass and trying to survive it. Clearly that didn't work for this dude, and it's a good lesson.

I think part of the ProNov instruction should be "you can't crash, but you also need to try to be in the race - just race toward the back of the pack". You're not really learning how to race when you tool around by yourself, you're just having your own personal track day.

That at being said, I honestly think that you gave this guy the one of the "ProvNov gifts" : experiencing and surviving a crash (hopefully he's OK), having to start over, learning from the experience and realizing that the world didn't come to an end. I know what I'm talking about because I did it twice, and frankly needed that extra time to learn how to calm down and race at "my level", as it were.

You can't police lap times. Any number you pick is purely arbitrary. Then what do you do if conditions are bad? Or get better - like Hallett? It is the passing rider's responsibility to avoid the slower rider - in all situations, not just yours.

dont think you restart, the process.
unless it was your last weekend to finish the probnov requirements.

most people think its a race to get the shirt off, and forget about the race on track.
i mean, yeah you dont want to crash, but its a painful fact of racing.

i clearly remember my buddies telling me slow down if you have to but dont crash !
then was like "im already slow enough, if i slow down any more , im getting A** packed, no thanks!! "
also remember Gabe pounding into the class, "hold your line!, the passer is responsible to make it safe ..."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dave Felio

Add to the ProvNov mental baggage that everyone around him (including that voice in his head) is telling him to "just get through the race without crashing'" which causes some people to overcompensate and just putt around giving everyone room to pass and trying to survive it. Clearly that didn't work for this dude, and it's a good lesson.

I think part of the ProNov instruction should be "you can't crash, but you also need to try to be in the race - just race toward the back of the pack". You're not really learning how to race when you tool around by yourself, you're just having your own personal track day.

That at being said, I honestly think that you gave this guy the one of the "ProvNov gifts" : experiencing and surviving a crash (hopefully he's OK), having to start over, learning from the experience and realizing that the world didn't come to an end. I know what I'm talking about because I did it twice, and frankly needed that extra time to learn how to calm down and race at "my level", as it were.

---

Nice write up :D
It's a race! Let's race!!! I'm with you 100%

If someone runs a 3:06 on a big bike in a big bike class, they shouldn't be allowed to race... lol


I think some of this stems all the way back to track day schools. I know of a school in particular that rushes to move people up levels so they can sell more seats, that will also pass anyone that pays for the cmra class.

Lol

I'm against minimum lap times too. The attempt would be to mitigate closing speeds, but that's not going to happen. Mechanicals, conditions, simple rider mentality can lead to changing lap speeds. I've had to roll off hard after a massive leg cramp. I then posed a closing speed problem. Situational awareness and safety are needed. Slow, consistent laps are fine, better than sketchy fast ones in my opinion.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chris Coffey

If someone runs a 3:06 on a big bike in a big bike class, they shouldn't be allowed to race... lol


I think some of this stems all the way back to track day schools. I know of a school in particular that rushes to move people up levels so they can sell more seats, that will also pass anyone that pays for the cmra class.

Lol

---

Those darn vest takers!
Lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Michael De Simone

It is the passing rider's responsibility to avoid the slower rider - in all situations, not just yours.

---

Let's also remember every racer has the opportunity to participate in the CMRA.

I agree with Michael, the correct answer isn't restrictions. The right answer is welcoming our new racer into the right classes for building his skills and developing his passion for racing.

Lightweight endurance, grom challenge, and so on all come to mind.

I hear the argument that when track days didn't exist you just came to the track and raced and humanity didn't cease to exist. Well, seat belts didn't exist before, but we all use 'em now don't we? You should be able to at least not be a rolling hazard when you get out there, and I don't mean you can't be dog slow, but you should at least be on the racing line, and able to hold that line when you are running at the back of the pack.

One way to come up with a lap time that isn't chosen arbitrarily is to come up with a minimum average mph that you are comfortable with and believe will be safe and translate that into a lap time. Food for thought anyway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chris Coffey

If someone runs a 3:06 on a big bike in a big bike class, they shouldn't be allowed to race... lol

---

We can't make a great club focusing on ruling people out.

The right answer is to welcome and mentor, not police and exclude.

Mitch,
Sorry to see what you went through and to hear your frustration. Have been in similar situations, and our competitive nature is understandable in this topic.
You were in a good pace there and it's definitely understandable on those little bikes, that every bike-length matters for a competitor to get away from you, coming upon slower traffic impeding on your lap(s).
From the video, it does not really look like lap-time duration was the issue for this Prov Nov, but the Prov Nov simply not being truly comfortable on the bike and able to respond to a situation of what occurred here. That rider, it appears did get very spooked by the pass ahead of you, completely went off-line and straight at the opposing curb (instead of leaning right) and you were just unfortunately behind to receive this result.
It was a tough spot for the move you were making and as pursuing your opponent, and there's no way you should have expected that Prov Nov to have panicked so radically, and at that pace.
As was mentioned about the certification instructors, and how they try to prepare riders in the Prov Nov class, this may / should be valuable training material for them, and of course for the tenured CMRA racers as well.

I have to agree with Jim, the prov nov just needs some coaching unfortunately it caused Mitchell to crash; I'm hoping both of you are okay. Did the other rider even crash?

Mitchell was on the race line and the prov nov didn't turn. As racers we assume at the very least the inexperienced rider will follow the track but in this case I do think the inside pass spooked him or her a bit and the rider was content with going straight not knowing another rider was anticipating they were going to turn.

I agree with some earlier posts about emphasizing HOLDING YOUR LINE to that particular rider. I'm sure this is covered at length but maybe this rider needs to go over it again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chris Coffey

I think some of this stems all the way back to track day schools. I know of a school in particular that rushes to move people up levels so they can sell more seats, that will also pass anyone that pays for the cmra class.

---

Seems like a loaded statement. Who are we talking about?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Brad Thomas

I have to agree with Jim, the prov nov just needs some coaching unfortunately it caused Mitchell to crash; I'm hoping both of you are okay. Did the other rider even crash?

Mitchell was on the race line and the prov nov didn't turn. As racers we assume at the very least the inexperienced rider will follow the track but in this case I do think the inside pass spooked him or her a bit and the rider was content with going straight not knowing another rider was anticipating they were going to turn.

I agree with some earlier posts about emphasizing HOLDING YOUR LINE to that particular rider. I'm sure this is covered at length but maybe this rider needs to go over it again.

---

The prov nob did not crash, thankfully he was able to continue and get some of his requirements done. As for me I have a sore elbow with a little rash, the bike on the other hand looks like it needs some work. Everything behind the steering stem seems to be functional and ok, but I honestly have been to busy with work and personal things to check it out yet. I believe this will most likely finish off my year, but I may try my 636 at cresson. Need to save money for next year. Maybe if it isn't as bad as it looks I may still pull off one more race this year, but it is doubtful.

Something I would like to get across is that I didn't want to bring in personal items into the discussion, hell i didn't even post the video. Plus I didn't want to call the racer out on this (though after it happened on Saturday it crossed my mind a time or two). I followed his build on another forum and have seen his experience in the past. I believe one day at Hallet and the day prior to this past weekend at TWS to get his license. I know it didn't even cross my mind to race at that point, nor did feel my skill level was anywhere near what it needed to be, and I started on the 250. So this thread was start a discussion about how others are verified that they safe and knowledgable about on track interactions and the race line. If that means someone has to be told to get a little more practice before racing, maybe that's what needs to be done, but I don't instruct or work for an affiliate who instructs. That's not my call, but if I bring awareness about the situation as a member of the club, then that is part of my basic rights as member.

I've always wondered if being involved in one of those "ProvNov splitter" moves is part of the required rites of passage anyway. It happens all the time, because front runners tend to end up in a battle toward the end of a race, which is just about the time the ProvNov lapping happens.

Danny Dominguez and Daniel Adams did it to me going to ricochet (MSR) on my last PN race, and made me feel like a construction cone. Danny went inside, and Adams went around the outside right before I flicked in and brushed my elbow and leg, then flicked in with NO room left and then blasted into the turn behind Danny.

It scared by balls off, but it was the coolest thing ever...I came off the track with the stupidest grin.

Hey Mitchell,
I'm in Dallas, if ya need a hand getting your bike fixed shoot me a pm.
brad

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dave Felio

I've always wondered if being involved in one of those "ProvNov splitter" moves is part of the required rites of passage anyway. It happens all the time, because front runners tend to end up in a battle toward the end of a race, which is just about the time the ProvNov lapping happens.

Danny Dominguez and Daniel Adams did it to me going to ricochet (MSR) on my last PN race, and made me feel like a construction cone. Danny went inside, and Adams went around the outside right before I flicked in and brushed my elbow and leg, then flicked in with NO room left and then blasted into the turn behind Danny.

It scared by balls off, but it was the coolest thing ever...I came off the track with the stupidest grin.

---

being a "back of the pack-er" myself, that often happens in my races on the SV650... I'm glad those guys are confident that I will maintain my line!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Brad Thomas

Hey Mitchell,
I'm in Dallas, if ya need a hand getting your bike fixed shoot me a pm.
brad

---

+1, give a holler if you need a hand! 20 minutes up to Allen with no rush-hour traffic.
Come on DeSimone, you're right there too! ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Greg Gilstrap

+1, give a holler if you need a hand! 20 minutes up to Allen with no rush-hour traffic.
Come on DeSimone, you're right there too! ;)

---

Unfortunately, I'm not right now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Brad Thomas

Hey Mitchell,
I'm in Dallas, if ya need a hand getting your bike fixed shoot me a pm.
brad

---

May take you up on this

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Brad Thomas

Hey Mitchell,
I'm in Dallas, if ya need a hand getting your bike fixed shoot me a pm.
brad

---

Mitchell I am happy to help you with any spare parts you may need if they are in my box. I have lots of extras!

I live down the street, so if ya need something, holler, I might have some extras as well. Also, I do ok fiberglass work, in my opinion. Basically, it will be hideous but functional. Hell, shoot me a PM and I'll bring some beer and we'll shoot the ****.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chris Woolsey

I live down the street, so if ya need something, holler, I might have some extras as well. Also, I do ok fiberglass work, in my opinion. Basically, it will be hideous but functional. Hell, shoot me a PM and I'll bring some beer and we'll shoot the ****.

---

i would say that my fiberglass work is AVERAGE. it will also look hideous but maybe in a different way. so now you have two options if you want help with fiberglass repair! Shoot me a PM if you want some help Mitch, i'm sorry to hear about your off. We've always had fun together at the track.

Related to the OP there is some verbiage in the CMRA rule book section 3.10 about significantly slower riders. There is no mention of lap times but it does state that being lapped within four laps is considered dangerously slower and at the discretion of CMRA officials that rider can be removed from racing for the weekend.

http://www.cmraracing.com/image/png;...AASUVORK5CYII=

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Robert Bremer

Related to the OP there is some verbiage in the CMRA rule book section 3.10 about significantly slower riders. There is no mention of lap times but it does state that being lapped within four laps is considered dangerously slower and at the discretion of CMRA officials that rider can be removed from racing for the weekend.

---

Significantly slower defined as being lapped in less than four laps by the leader of the same class the rider is participating in.

At our track days, it's easy for us to control situations where a rider is too slow (or fast) for a given group. At a race, not so much. Not to mention, if you try to place lap time controls upon a racer the problem of monitoring, policing, and then rectifying that issue comes to play. Who is able to monitor and oversee that responsibility?

Reason dictates that if you're racing and a rider is a danger to himself and others on the track, you should report it. Not all of these riders are going to be caught during licensing school, especially if it's a situation where the rider is at a track new to them.

My hope would be that a rider in the above situation would ask for help on the Friday practice or on Saturday's practice from a BOD member or rider rep. I doubt that ever happens.

I also disagree with some points Mr Dugger is aluding to. There are some situations where people simply don't need to be racing (yet) and should not take the grid. I agree with the aspect of mentoring and retaining the membership, and as a partner to the CMRA I would say that LSTD would be willing to play a big role in that development and mentorship. But after they're identified, I don't think that they should be retained simply to keep the membership in the club.

While conducting the mock races, I have personally directed some candidates to avoid getting their license simply because they're just too slow and potentially dangerous. There have also been times when we have not given that pink sheet to them for these reasons. I'm going to guess that the other track day partners do the same. Regardless, it's not a perfect solution and riders do fall through the cracks. Not saying that is the case here, but it does happen.

Would love to hear other (viable) solutions presented.

Don't mean to fork the thread, but the topic does make me wonder about the view of riders who enter a race following a crash in a previous race and they're injured or the bike passes inspection but really isn't race-worthy. They go out and turn a lap or two for the points, but extremely slow. I've seen it many times.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tom Anderson

There are some situations where people simply don't need to be racing (yet) and should not take the grid. I agree with the aspect of mentoring and retaining the membership, and as a partner to the CMRA I would say that LSTD would be willing to play a big role in that development and mentorship. But after they're identified, I don't think that they should be retained simply to keep the membership in the club.

---

Not sure if I quite came across correctly if that's what you took away.

I really appreciate the LSTD partnership, and know of at least one other track day school's license class that will direct new racers not quite on the pace to lightweight racing first. I agree, this and LSTD's approach is a good practice. And, as far as I'm concerned you guys already DO play a role in development and mentorship and it's not a big secret I came to racing significantly through your coaching.

My original comment was more along the lines of us as a community of participants in the sport should mentor and develop this new racer. It's not about maintaining membership without reasonable considerations, but it is acknowledging we have a responsibility to approach membership with an inclusive attitude, not an exclusive one.

I actually think we share the same mindset, just get to the conclusion a bit differently.

Quote:

---

Would love to hear other (viable) solutions presented.

---

The best thing for our sport and our club is to develop new passions for it.

One of the reasons I didn't race at TWS this round was because I'm just too slow on the track to compete. I took the numbers off my bike and rode the track day. I'm trying to decide if I'm done.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chris Pearson

One of the reasons I didn't race at TWS this round was because I'm just too slow on the track to compete. I took the numbers off my bike and rode the track day. I'm trying to decide if I'm done.

---

To slow to compete with anybody?
That is one thing I like, I'm not the fastest but you are always either being pulled or pulling someone in a race so there is always direct competition.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Brandon Orr

To slow to compete with anybody?
That is one thing I like, I'm not the fastest but you are always either being pulled or pulling someone in a race so there is always direct competition.

---

I had a fantastically fun race with the back pack in races 3 & 5 at tws. I couldn't agree more with your comment.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by John Redford

Mitchell I am happy to help you with any spare parts you may need if they are in my box. I have lots of extras!

---

Btw John it's all your fault 😂

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Brandon Orr

To slow to compete with anybody?
That is one thing I like, I'm not the fastest but you are always either being pulled or pulling someone in a race so there is always direct competition.

---

I'm almost always running by myself...except when I'm getting lapped.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chris Pearson

I'm almost always running by myself...except when I'm getting lapped.

---

Take some classes and hit some trackdays, it will click soon enough. I'd ride with you at the track but I am not sure I am one to really help anybody.

My two cents....With me being a fixture at the back of the pack, I work hard on maintaining my / the correct lines so those faster do not encounter any surprises getting past me. While I joke about my inability to run at the front, I do ask those faster if I am doing anything wrong. I ask for that feedback. It is important to me that (a) I don't ruin anyone's day and (b) everyone have fun. I sincerely hope I am never an issue. If I am, let me know.

Get track time. Get instruction. Then, get more instruction. Don't look behind you. As stated, it is the rider passing to make the pass. Safely.

Have a great weekend all!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chris Pearson

I'm almost always running by myself...except when I'm getting lapped.

---

I never seeing such a sad post like this one before :(





http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/...pse35f01de.pngCMRA# 672

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jim Dugger

I actually think we share the same mindset, just get to the conclusion a bit differently.

---

Probably! I guess I was reading more of a concern from you leaning toward membership retention at the sake of saying, "Hey, we've observed your racing and we can't let you race any more until your pace and safety improve" vs "Keep on racing, we don't want to lose you as a member and hopefully you'll get better."
Sometimes I think it should just be said that this sport isn't for everyone. Of course I've seen some really fast dudes that would be considered "dangerous" too and have been disciplined for it too.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JimBob DuggarCantCookOnBGE

The best thing for our sport and our club is to develop new passions for it.

---

Yes!

Beginning with Keith, Chuck, and Eric Falt's idea of the ESS class way back when (and shows no sign of slowing, even with the 300 and 500 around); to the more recent successful idea of Team 60 and Solo 30 (cough, cough Red River Challenge, cough, cough) and the invasion of the Gromnation. I'm with you there.

That still doesn't answer the question of the OP. And I hate coming up with questions that have no solution offered. For this, I have a couple, all of which may benefit the CMRA partners and supporters...

I am the subject in question.... I never once denied that..
In fact I have mentioned it specifically in this and two other forums. I offered an apology for my mistake and admitted I was partially at fault for this incident. So I'm not hiding behind a computer screen from any of this... At the beginning of the F4 round I spoke to Linz to make sure the other rider was ok.. and was told he was fine.. On retrospect I geuss I should have sought you out Mitchell to make sure in person.. Now I wish I had done that.
So first off again, Mitchell I am sorry for my bonehead rookie mistake and apologise for causing you an injury and a busted bike. I truly mean that.. if I could take back the moment I would but I can't and will have to try to move on.


I read and listened to every one of the comments made on this thread and now feel I need to share my views.
Every person came to this club in some way... some had family involved for years and grew up with it, some started on their own when they were young and before there were trackdays. Others have gotten involved through friends and were able to do the trackday scene and progress into the sport... But the pathway to this sport is not the same for everyone. Not everyone is blessed with opportunnity.
I have been a follower of the series for some time but only from the sidelines. I wanted to race but was not financially ready and of coarse had no real experiance anyways. I cornerworked when I could to get close to the track, made a fool of myself asking anyone I could all kinds of questions and reading, watching everything I could on the sport... coming into the sport at such a late date I was seriously behind the curve... but I have desire and I have passion for the sport and that may be all I have but it's what I have to work with.
A few here have made some assumptions on me.. and maybe they are valid to some point but until you walk in my shoes don't think you know everything about me..
I live a hell of a long way from these tracks... My address is Claremore, Ok but that's only the address.. my home is in Foyil, which you probably never heard of. It's in the sticks northeast of Tulsa by quite a ways and even Hallett is 2 1/2-3 hours away and all the other tracks... well you can do the math. While most of you (not all... I know) have the luxery of being able to schedule trackdays and training classes a couple of times a month.. that is not my fortune. My hometown does not have a sport bike scene... there are no group rides, folks going to Hallett or anywhere else. It's all farm trucks, sprint cars and the steel plant... I'm not going to justify or sit here and list off how many hours of seat time I have. I'm not whining or crying about how hard it is for me and many more others like me to get get involved. And this not any kind of excuse.. I just want to put into perspective where I'm coming from.
To maybe some others my experiance just is not enough to warrant a race license but you you know what? I went through all the steps, spent all the money, bought all the equipment and was told what to do and when to do it.. I followed the rules and was with awarded a paper that said I could go out and try my hand at racing.... one race weekend , one mistake and now I'm being crucified and some want to run me out of town on a hot rail.... And maybe it is my fault.. I thought the race scool was more closely monitered...I should have asked for help on a track I never rode on... I should not have just tried to find the lines myself and of that I am guilty.
So for my first time ever... On Saturday I was not 100% as I never rode on TWS ever.. I was on a bike I probably didn't have enough time on to be comfortable. and I was going onto the track with some pretty fast, well experianced people. The gist of this thread was about being too slow... maybe I was but how do I know for sure until I get out there. But for those of you who care, you can add in that my bike was a giving me some issues and that slowed me down, if you had a way to check my speeds on track sections, where I was really losing time on was that exact portion where the incident occured.. I was trying to get the race line down and maybe was spooked a little by the inside pass... and maybe after two days I should have already have that down.. sorry I failed.. sorry I caused a incident.. But maybe some forget what a first day was like!
Because not only was all the above going on but I got lost in the timing of the day, I learned the hard way about calls and session timing.. trying to fiqure out tech and all too.. I pitted away from the announcer and did not have a scanner.. missed some practice time because and was late to grids too... I was in frantic mode all day and could not seem to catch up. Nothing went like I thought it would but I pushed through all of that and tried to make the best of the deal... And the comments are right above, they hammered about not crashing, not crashing, not crashing,,, all the time I have been around the club I was hearing that the novices and all would see your yellow shirt so don't worry... just run your pace stay safe and don't crash... plus I didn't want to trash myself or my bike first time out..
Bottom line for me is that though I am really sorry about Mitchell's bike and his sore arm I don't feel this is a matter of me being too slow or me not having forty track days under my belt...... I think I made a bad choice in a bad place at probably the worst time... when we were all bunched in the tightest portion of the track... While faster riders were chasing each other... and I was just trying not to crash.. I ended up three laps down that race.. but even getting hit I did not crash.. I lost one lap from being passed.. another which happened during the incident and lost the other because I pulled off track and went to tech to make sure my bike was still safe (which Steve told me I really didn't need to do cause I did not crash) and then to pit not finishing the race... I feel it was a bad set of circumstances all falling together at the worst possible time...
I look back and wonder what I could have really done different and think maybe there are some things but in the heat of the moment sometimes things don't always go as planned... this surely was not the way I planned it.. but if I was as bad as everyone says then how is it that I was able to compete in the following F4 session without incident.. better my time even while running a sick bike? Slow? yes... dangerously slow? I expect that the CMRA officials are watching these races and if they felt I was a danger they would have black flagged me(which I was constantly looking for) or at least came to me afterwards and said something...
But for sure now I have a target painted on my back... CMRA officials will be watching me... other riders will be watching me... I have become an instant parihra in one single weekend.. I am sure that with all that are going to have me on the microscope plate that before the Friday/Saturday practices are done the CMRA will have made a decision whether I will be allowed to race.
I will be at the next session and I will looking to redeem myself... I am going to try to find a way to be much better prepared and hopefully that will be enough to dispell your concerns... I already have contacted some folks in the ranks that I think may be able to help me out and if and anyone else is willing to do so I am open to all advise and critique. But I will be there and I will looking to compete... hopefully it will be a better outcome...
Mitchell... Again I am sorry... if there is anything I can do to help you let me know...

Scott - you are welcome at any race and any track. Come look me up anytime, I would love to spend time riding with you and we can learn the track together.

Please understand you did nothing wrong…the bike in front cannot, and should not, see what is happening behind. The thought that a target is painted on your back is yours and yours only, I am quite certain that NO ONE that has posted in this thread feels that way.