UPDATED! 11/23/13 2014 Rule and Class Structure changes

[Tom Anderson]

the 250s battling with the 500s is no different than the BBE with lightweight bikes and the liter bikes...

It's happened before but the Idiots have won BBE overall two years in a row. It can happen in LW Endurance too.

Totally agree about the 250 not being a mini. When they were first injected to the "mini" class the arguments against that are still true today.

I'm going to print WW's post saying that I can run F4 on my Ape RS125 too… ;)

[Heinz Roy]

Wow! That will teach me to look at the board more often!

Thanks Walter...I am sure this is going to require a few bottles of Tums to get through all this...

Give me a place to race, a class to race in, and I'm a happy middle-aged, fat kid!

[Jeremy Harvey]

You're a smart guy Jeremy, very smart, so don't go all "duh" on me now. If they don't weight what Becka does, and they're still absolutely flying, my math cries foul. But we all know my math isn't very good.

I do know of one 250 that definitely has more motor than ours (the guy doesn't race in CMRA), and knowing who put the bike together, it's definitely SS legal, so I wasn't too surprised to have others make more power, especially if they run race fuel, as we never run anything other than pump. And I figured there were some people trying to extract more power out of them, but I didn't realize they were spending that much (or going outside the rules), and that's what surprised me.

When I would get passed during the last few 250 endurance races, I always considered the pass to be from a more talented rider, not because of a stronger motor. With ours being completely stock (except for the obvious jet kit and exhaust) and still having decent finishes, I wouldn't have thought about doing anything else to the motor; I'd spend money on suspension to replace the stock forks and Elka rear shock we're running before anything else. I've heard the motors can be different though, even in stock configuration, so I guess we just got lucky and found a good one.

Walter, regarding suspension in a spec class, is there any consideration to limiting what can be done there as well, to keep cost down, such as only emulators in the forks (no AK-20 or similar allowed)?

[John Black]

It's happened before but the Idiots have won BBE overall two years in a row. It can happen in LW Endurance too.

Totally agree about the 250 not being a mini. When they were first injected to the "mini" class the arguments against that are still true today.

I'm going to print WW's post saying that I can run F4 on my Ape RS125 too… ;)

I don't disagree with that... I think the 300s and some of the "more super stock than other 250s" will be able to run with the 500s... or at least keep the 500s honest and if there are issues they can take advantage... hell, david rice and I would have murdered the field on our 20+ year old, heavy, slow dinosaur of a bike that stock barely makes more HP than the EX300... LoPan was powered by the black blood of the earth and would have brought the hell of boiling oil with it to the grid, but, now it is illegal for the class... as it stands, I guess I am going to have to shoe horn sperry into his leathers and we are going to bring the Mori back to play in F4 with those sexy Aprillias... not sure who else is going to bother with running a real race bike with little chance of an overall... AND WHY IS MY CARRIAGE RETURN NOT WORKING!!!!!!!

[Walter Walker]

Walter, regarding suspension in a spec class, is there any consideration to limiting what can be done there as well, to keep cost down, such as only emulators in the forks (no AK-20 or similar allowed)?

Yes, The plan is to have a list of specific parts that will be allowed.

FYI, we have potential vendors working on pricing for complete race ready bikes for lease or purchase for both classes. We are also have potential vendors putting together pricing for race kits for both platforms. We hope that these options will make these classes easy to get into, affordable, and very competitive.

[Scott McDermott]

I agree Walter, weighing the heaviest guy would be a silly assumption. However, in a spec class where sprockets and bars are the heavy items on the swappable list, a weight limit suggests at least some stuffing of socks on the 8 year olds. I was just throwing out my 2c and moving on. It's all I have to say on the matter. I won't be arguing it, just needed to get it out. If you were indeed only referring to bike weight in the spec class I apologize for thinking you'd gone all 4 wheel autocross on us and will give you half my mashed potatoes for a week as punishment.

What I'd really like a Yes or No on is whether there's the slightest chance you're still considering a 2 stroke class that could go after endurance overall. My assumption is that your stating the CBR500 will be the only bike in the class means you are not; but I don't want to be caught assuming. and THANK YOU!

Black, you're dating yourself with CARRIAGE return

[Heinz Roy]

Update:

Endurance race starts, all endurance machines must be on the starting grid or false grid no later than 10 mins before the scheduled race start time. Tire warmers and generators will be allowed.

Walter...most tracks the pits are near the starting grid...TWS, Hallett, and Eagles...what about Cresson when the BBE grid is south of Big Bend (CCW I believe)? Seems like a logistical headache to get over there and back....especially if there is a red flag in the early laps. Just putting this out there.

[Ted Phillips]

Walter...most tracks the pits are near the starting grid...TWS, Hallett, and Eagles...what about Cresson when the BBE grid is south of Big Bend (CCW I believe)? Seems like a logistical headache to get over there and back....especially if there is a red flag in the early laps. Just putting this out there.

I understood it to mean the goal is to prevent teams from starting from behind the pit wall or elsewhere. Even if the start/finish at MSR is way off yonder, all teams still start their warm-up lap from hot pit. This rule just requires everyone's bike to be present in hot pit 10 minutes before the start.

I think we're a few years off from full on MotoGP style grid starts with umbrella girls, starting carts, and velvet ropes keeping reporters at bay, but I hope I'm wrong.

[Heinz Roy]

I understood it to mean the goal is to prevent teams from starting from behind the pit wall or elsewhere. Even if the start/finish at MSR is way off yonder, all teams still start their warm-up lap from hot pit. This rule just requires everyone's bike to be present in hot pit 10 minutes before the start.

I think we're a few years off from full on MotoGP style grid starts with umbrella girls, starting carts, and velvet ropes keeping reporters at bay, but I hope I'm wrong.

Ahhhh....okay...gotcha.

[Christopher Corder]

No it will be allowed in F4 also.

Thank goodness. I was sweating there for a minute.